Heavenly Sanctuary

Pastor Doug: Hello, friends, would you like to hear an amazing fact? the largest building in the world by volume is the Boeing factory in Everett, Washington. This is where the company assembles the wide body 747, 767, 777, and the 787 dream liner aircraft. The massive building covers nearly 100 acres, and contains more than 472 million cubic feet. It is so big you can fit all of Disneyland inside and still have room left over. The Everett Boeing Factory also employs about 30,000 people, including it's own fire department, security team, daycare center and fitness center. Did you know the Bible talks about a dwelling place that is even bigger? Stay with us friends, we are going to learn more as Amazing Facts brings you this edition of Bible Answers Live.

Ad: You are listening to Bible Answers Live, honest answers to your Bible questions. Our phone lines are now open. If you have a Bible related question, call us at 1800-GOD-SAYS. That's 1800-463-7297. Let's get to our first Bible question with pastor Doug Batchelor and our co-host, pastor Jean Ross.

Pastor Doug: Hello, listening friends. This is Bible Answers Live, live international, interactive Bible study, and we invite you to join us. Of course, you can listen, if you have a Bible question, we'd encourage you to give us a call. Free phone call 800-GOD-SAYS, 800-463-7297, I'm Doug Batchelor.

Pastor Ross: My name is Jean Ross, good evening listening friends and Pastor Doug. Once again, let's start the program with the word of prayer. Dear father, we are grateful to begin to spend some time studying the Bible together, and we ask for your blessing upon this program. We ask that you'd be with those listening wherever they might be and lead us Lord into a clear understanding of Bible truth. We ask this in Jesus' name, Amen.

Pastor Doug: Amen.

Pastor Ross: Pastor Doug, you opened the program by talking about an immense building, and it's hard to imagine a building that is actually bigger than Disneyland.

Pastor Doug: Put all Disneyland inside. Now, that's not, there are several Disneylands around the world. I think they are talking about the one in Anaheim.

Pastor Ross: Even so, that's a big place. Now, you can just imagine walking from one end of the building to the other, and then back to pickup a tool that you forgot.

Pastor Doug: You need to take life support systems.

Pastor Ross: You'll have some sort of transportation system inside that massive building.

Pastor Doug: Yes, but just to be fair and accurate, there are plans on the board. I understand Tesla is going to be building another building I think in Nevada where they are going to be making batteries, and it will be the biggest building in the world. At least the footprint, I don't know if it'll have the same volume. The Boeing building, because they have to build them so high to house the jets, have a lot more cubic feet. We have some big buildings, but nothing compared to a building we are going to talk about today.

In the Bible friends, it tells us that when the children of Israel came out of Egypt, God helped them build a sanctuary, and he gave them the plans, like he gave Noah the plans for the ark, he game Moses the plans for this temple, a portable temple. The one on earth was a miniature for a very real dwelling place that God has in heaven. Even when Solomon dedicated the temple that he built, permanent temple in Jerusalem, he said and you can find this in 1 Kings 8:27, "But will God indeed dwell on earth, behold the heaven in the heavens of heavens cannot contain you. How much less this temple that I have built."

And Isaiah 66:1 it says, "Thus says the Lord, the heaven is my throne, the earth is my footstool. Where is the house that you will build for me?". I remember as a kid my grandmother drove by Synagogue and it was an unusual building and I said, "Grandma, what is that?" She said, "That's a house of God." And I thought, "Wow, I didn't know God could fit in a house like that." It was very ominous to me.

For instance, in the earthly temple, it had the angels on the wallpaper in the holy of holies. In heaven, there are probably real angels that surround God like a living wall in it, instead of it being whatever it was, 50 cubits across I think in Solomon's temple. It might be a light year across. It's going to be immense, and so there is nothing on earth, no building on earth can compare. And we don't know exactly how big it is, because Paul says, "The eye hasn't seen, the ear has not heard, neither has entered into the heart of man the things that God has prepared for those that love him."

In other words, we can't even imagine it, but we can understand something about what the purpose of that temple was, because God said it helps us understand the plan of salvation. The geometry and the architecture of the earthly temple teaches us about God. We'd like to share a unique lesson with you for free, it's illustrated color. If you'd like to understand the secrets of salvation as found in the earthly temple, we have a free offer.

Pastor Ross: If you'd like to receive our study guide called, God Drew the Plans, the number to call for that is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the study guide God Drew the Plans, and I think you'll enjoy studying through that. A lot of great information, and if you have a Bible question, the phone line here to the studio is 800-463-7297. We do have some phone lines that are open. This is a good time to give us a call to get your question on the air. Again, that number is 800-463-7297. Pastor Doug, we are going to go to our first call of this evening, we have somebody not too far away from where we are right now. David is listening in Sacramento. David, welcome to the program.

David: Hi.

Pastor Doug: Hi David.

David: Hi, Pastor Doug. My question is from a verse in the book of Genesis. it is Genesis 3, and it looks like the last sentence or so in verse 15 of chapter 3.

Pastor Doug: All right, where it says, "He will bruise your head, and you will bruise his heel?"

David: What do those words mean?

Pastor Doug: All right, good question. We'll do our best to answer that. And this is one of the first prophecies that you find in the Bible, and it's where God is telling the woman following the fall of man and sin, that there was going to be this ongoing conflict between the church, and the woman is the symbol of that, and the seed of the woman. The seed of the woman is promised savior that would come, is Jesus.

You can read about the battle of the woman, the serpent, and the seed, is even found in Revelation 12. Talks about the dragon wanted to devour the man child, the seed of the woman as soon as he was born, but he was caught up to God's throne. That seed of the woman, that promised Messiah, God would become a man, that is the seed of the woman. And this battle, when it says that the serpent would bruise the heel, Well, serpents are on the ground and it can get to your heel, but because the serpent is cursed and it's on the ground, a man's foot can stomp a serpent's head. And that would be a mortal wound.

If you are bitten on the heel, that would impede your progress. It would slow you down, but it won't stop you. Through history, the serpent has continued to nip at the heels of God's church, but in the end, the seed of the serpent, Jesus, is going to stump the head of-- the seed of the woman rather, is going to stomp the head of the serpent. We actually have a book on that too.

Pastor Ross: We do. Ultimately, in that passage, the seed of the woman represents Christ, and the serpent is a symbol of Satan. And it's referring to the cross where Jesus indeed did that receive that serpent bite, and yet Jesus was victorious over the devil and that he rose from the dead. We do have a book written by Pastor Doug, I think it deals with this very subject, we don't get to offer this book too often, but it's a great resource. It's called, The Savior and the Serpent.

I think it builds right on the very verse in Genesis 3:15. The number to call for this free offer, is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the book called, The Savior and the Serpent. Again, that number is 800-835-6747. And the telephone number here to the studio is 800-463-7297, 800-463-7297. Next caller is Joe, and he is listening in Staten Island, New York. Joe, welcome to the program.

Joe: Thank you very much. Was the garden of Eden on earth? And also, was nature, and what I mean by nature, I mean like the natural world as far as like hurricanes, and earthquakes, asteroids, and also the animals. Was nature violent before Adam and Eve sinned?

Pastor Doug: Okay, good questions. First question, was the garden of Eden literal and was it on earth? that would be yes. The Bible is pretty clear that Adam and Eve went forth from the garden to populate the earth. All the language that’s used makes it clear that the garden was real. It was on earth, and people have gone in epic quests looking for the Garden of Eden, and Fountain of Youth, Tree of Life. And of course they haven’t found it, because that all existed before the flood.

Now, it’s not in the Bible, but many commentators have agreed that God did something supernatural to assume, to catch up the garden, or at least the tree, because the Tree of Life is in the new earth. In the same way, the Bible says the New Jerusalem will come down from God out of heaven. That’s in Revelation 21, that the tree could come down, and the garden could come down. He may have preserved the garden before the flood, because it was his garden. He planted it.

Now, on the question of death and earthquakes, there was no violence, there was no death, the animals were not ferocious before sin. When the Lord restores the earth, it will be returned that way. It says there’ll be peace. The meek will inherit the earth. There’ll be no fear. The lion will lay down with a lamb, and the wolf, and a kid, and a calf, and the bear, they’re all going to frolic together. The lion leads, stroll like the oxen. The Bible is really clear, and that’s Isiah 11, and some other verses that there was no death until sin. Yes, good questions.

Pastor Ross: Yes, with reference to earthquakes, it seems there’s an increase of those. Jesus did say, that as we near the end of time, there will be an increase of earthquakes, and talks about the sea and the waves roaring. It seems that there are changes occurring in nature. I found this verse in Isaiah 51:6, where it says “The earth shall wax old like a garment.” It’s talking about near the end of time where it seems that even the earth is getting worn out, getting old, and that the results of that is some of these natural disasters that we see.

Pastor Doug: Yes, I appreciate that, Joe. Thank you, and appreciate your call.

Pastor Ross: Next caller is Robert, listening in New Jersey. Robert, welcome to the program.

Robert: Yes, good evening, Pastor Doug and Pastor Ross. My question is concerning divine election and predestination, because I usually hear that [unintelligible 00:12:20]. In particular, Romans 8:28-30, and Ephesians1:4-11, it suggests about being chosen from the foundation of the world can you explain that?

Pastor Doug: Yes, first of all, God knows everything. I think everybody agrees on that. One thing that we need to be careful about, I believe the most dangerous thing about what we call the predestination, the Calvinism, is the idea that God did not want everyone to be saved. 2 Peter 3 is very clear, "God who would have all men to be saved", or rather, "God is not willing that any should perish, but they all should come to repent." And then in Timothy it says, “God who would have all men to be saved.” And of course, John 3:16, “Who so ever”, it’s a great invitation “believes in him. Come unto me all who are weary and heavy laden.”

The idea that God has pre-chosen who will be saved, is different from the idea that he knows in advance, because God knows everything. He of course knows who’s going to be saved and who’s going to be lost. That’s different from him making it happen, because if God makes it happen, if you make someone love you, it’s not really love. God gives us freewill, and this is such a very important issue to understand.

Everybody does have a choice. The idea that God makes it happen takes away the freedom of choice that we have. What makes the elect the elect? Well, God did choose the nation of Israel, but that did not mean he only wanted them to be saved. He wanted Israel to be a nation of priests to reach everybody. He wanted all to come to the light of their shining, the Bible says. I think Jesus has basically told us many are called, few are chosen. Everyone is invited, few respond, those who respond are chosen. They are the elect. Does that make a little sense Robert?

Robert: Yes, it does. Do you have any material on this subject?

Pastor Doug: We do. Is it, Can a Saved Man Be Lost?

Pastor Ross: Yes, it’s a book entitled Can a Saved Man Choose to be Lost? We’ll be happy to send that to you. The number to call is 800-835-6747. Again, you can ask for the book, Can a Saved Man Choose to be Lost? You can also read it online if you just go to the Amazing Facts website, amazingfacts.org, and you just type in there the book title, Can a Saved Man Choose to be Lost?, and you will be able to read the PDF version for free. Our next caller is Billy, and he is listening from Columbia, Carolina. Billy, welcome to the program.

Billy: How are you doing Pastor Ross and Pastor Doug?

Pastor Doug: Thanks, and it looks your listening on WBAJ.

Billy: Well, [unintelligible 00:15:12] but that’s the radio station preferred around here.

Pastor Doug: Good for you.

Billy: My question is, I guess I’m asking a question between say, King James, and why is it missing in other translations. Say, John 5:4, why is that missing say from NIV?

Pastor Doug: The reason is that the manuscripts that were used to translate versions like the King James, the New King James, new American standard, they used something called the Textus Receptus, and we’re talking about New Testament manuscripts. Most Bibles use the same Old Testament manuscripts, because the Jews have pretty good copies of that around the world. The New Testament, there are only some fragments.

When they translated the NIV and some of the other modern translations, they used something called the Vaticanus and the Sinaiticus. The one was found as you can tell from the name at the Vatican Library, and the other one was at a St. Catherine’s Monastery on Mount Sinai, and that was the Sinaiticus. Those were suspected or suspicious manuscripts, parts of them were missing, and because of that, they weren’t complete. Some of them didn’t contain certain verses for instance in John 8, the whole passage about the woman caught in adultery, it wasn’t in the Sinaiticus and the Vaticanus. You’d be losing a lot of your Bible if you use that translation. I prefer, I don’t know, Pastor Ross may feel the same way that you use the versions, the translations that use the Textus Receptus.

Pastor Ross: There's different suggestions as to why you want to trust more of the Textus Receptus, or the Textus Receptus is based upon a set of manuscript called Byzantine manuscripts or texts. It’s likely that if somebody was copying out original manuscripts and for some reason they couldn’t see something, or maybe part of the parchment was destroyed, it’s likely that they leave that out. They wouldn’t try and make something up. The fact that we have in the Textus Receptus portions of scripture that’s not found in the other set of manuscripts, so that indicates that it’s not that these stories were made up, because that’s very unlikely, but rather than in the other manuscripts, it was lost, or it wasn’t there, and so they didn’t include it when they did their final translations like NIV and some of the popular translations.

Pastor Doug: Yes, and on that same thing, you just reminded me the things that are discrepancies, are almost always at the beginning or end of what we would call a chapter or section like Mark 16, beginning of John 8. It’s like they lost the beginning, or they lost the end. Yes, we believe in the complete text. And some of the other versions, I’m not as positive about.

Pastor Ross: We do have a book called The Ultimate Resource. Billy, it’s all about the Bible. Talk a little bit about the manuscripts, and how you study the Bible, and that kind of thing. We’ll be happy to send this book for free to you if you’d give us a call. The number is 800-835-6747, and ask for the book called The Ultimate Resource. Again, that’s 800-835-6747. By the way, that’s not only Billy that can call for that book. Anyone listening can call, ask for the book, The Ultimate Resource we’ll be happy to give it you. If you have a Bible question the phone line here to the studio is 800-463-7297. That’s 800-463-7297. Our next caller is Timothy listening from Nevada. Timothy, welcome to the program.

Timothy: Thank you Pastor Ross and Pastor Batchelor.

Pastor Doug: Thank you.

Timothy: I got a question about Colossians 2:16, you probably get this a lot. I know it’s not based on a fact, it wasn’t nailed to the cross, but people use this as [unintelligible 00:19:20] versus to save, leave it kind of thing?

Pastor Doug: Yes, do you want me to read that or you’re going to read it?

Timothy: Whichever if you’re –

Pastor Doug: Yes, I know a lot of people when we mention a verse they’re driving. They can’t always read it. Colossians 2:16 says, “So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival, or New Moon, or Sabbaths which are a shadow of things to come but the substances of Christ.” People sometimes read that verse and they say, “See, this is the evidence Christians don’t need to worry about the Sabbath anymore, because it says don’t let anyone judge you about that.” That’s not what its saying.

I’ve never heard anybody use this verse for going to church on Sunday. They only use this verse when they hear the Sabbath truth. That's the seventh day of the week and they say, "Oh no, we're not under the law anymore, we don't need to keep the Sabbath. This verse actually says, "Let no man judge you regarding new moon or Sabbaths." It's plural. Sabbaths which are shadows, so it doesn't just say any Sabbath, not the seventh day Sabbath, but the Sabbaths which are shadows of things to come. Those were the annual feast day Sabbaths which are nailed to the cross.

The idea that Paul would shrug and say, "I know it's one of the Ten Commandments, but don't let anyone give you a hard time about one of the Ten Commandments. If you want to keep it, that's up to you. If you don't, no big deal." God actually had a man stoned in the Bible when they said he was breaking the Sabbath. What should we do? They brought them to the Lord and Lord said, "Put them to death." This was the commandment of God. It was pretty important. I'm not recommending we do that today, but I'm just saying that it wasn't a blase suggestion of God. It was one of the ten commandments.

That's the key, I think. It's a Sabbaths in Colossians, which are shadows, and he's also talking about food, and drink, offerings. These things are all connected with the sanctuary and its services, which Christians is part of the ceremonial law. It's all been nailed to the cross. By the way, the Ten Commandments were written on stone. The Ceremonial and Levitical laws were written on paper. You can nail paper to the cross, but you probably couldn't nail the Ten Commandments very easily.

Caller: Yes, Okay.

Pastor Doug: I think we've got a book that talks about written in stone.

Pastor Ross: We've got a book, but I think we even have something better than that if people have access to the internet. We do have a website, called sabbathtruth.com. There is just a host of information. You know Pastor Doug, from time to time, people call or people write, and they ask for more information about the Sabbath. Where can we go to learn what the Bible has to say about this?

This website is specifically designed with a lot of scriptural references, there's some video. There's actually a whole documentary there that talks about the history of the Sabbath. Just a great resource. Again, that website is sabbathtruth.com, and I encourage everyone, anyone wanting to know more about this to take a look at that website, it will be a blessing. If you have a Bible question, the phone line again here is to the studio is 800-463-7297, 800-463-7297. Next caller is Thomas, listening from Bronx, New York. Thomas, welcome to the program.

Thomas: Hello.

Pastor Ross: Evening.

Thomas: I would like to know if the Bible mentions anything about Christmas, and if not, why do Christians celebrate it?

Pastor Doug: All right, good question, but I need to be honest with you, Thomas. You're the first one this year. Usually we don't get those calls until November, but we're happy to-- people start wondering about Christmas in November and of course December. No, the word Christmas of course is not merry. The word Christmas is driven from the Christ Mass, it was a special mass that was celebrated in the catholic church. It's come to become and all encompassing word, and so that's just the etymology of the word.

The idea or remembering the birth of Christ, there's nothing morally wrong with remembering something that is accounted for in the Bible. The Bible does talk in Matthew and Luke about the birth of Jesus. You don't really read about it in Mark or in the gospel of John. And to be thankful and remember that, if people want to give gifts because of that, that's great. If they start making the day like its a holy day, that's not biblical because it probably wasn't the 25th of December.

A matter of fact, we can be fairly certain it wasn't the 25th of December. That date came to us really through Christians trying to reach the Pagans in Rome, and their birth of the new year and myth worship was-- you see the shortest day in the year is December in the Northern Hemisphere, is December 31st. I'm sorry, 21st. The days don't get noticeably longer until the 25th. And so, they thought it's like a big birth of the sun. The new birth of the sun. And so they just began to say, "Well, we got to find a day for Jesus' birth. Maybe that was it."

If you look in the Bible, it tells us when Jesus was born, the shepherds were out in the fields with their flocks. In Bethlehem, it's cold and rainy, and they're not going to be out in the fields on the 25th of December. It also tells us that Caesar ordered a national or international census where everyone had to travel to the place of their birth to be registered for taxes. He would never do that in the middle of winter, when there's no food in the fields for people to glean. That was very likely done in the fall.

Third thing, is we have some idea that Jesus was born in August, September, because we know when Jesus died, which was pass-over, spring. And it says he ministered three and a half years, so all you do is count back three and a half years from when he died, and you know that he was born in the fall. If people want to remember the birth of Jesus, and thank the Lord for that, and share gifts with somebody, there's nothing wrong with that. I think Christians ought to stay away from the Pagan trap-ins of Christmas, Santa Claus, and the elves, and Poinsettas and all that stuff. It's where you put in Romans 14, "If you're going to regard a day, regard it to the Lord." That's a long answer Thomas. I hope that helps a little bit.

Thomas: Yes, it helps. I used to say to myself this is not something that God wants us to do. Wouldn't that be a sin?

Pastor Doug: Well, not necessarily. Just because there's no commandment to do something, doesn't make it all morally wrong. There's no commandment in the Bible to remember your birthday, but if you give someone a birthday gift, my grandson has his ninth birthday today. Happy birthday, Matthew. I already called and told him, and I said, "Thank God for another year." There's nothing wrong with that. Just because something is not commanded to be done in the Bible, doesn't automatically make it morally wrong. There's no commandment for the Thanksgiving holiday, but it's a good holiday. We do have a book we can send you, Thomas, called Feast Days and, no, what was it? Paganism and

Pastor Ross: Baptized Paganism, is that what its called?

Pastor Doug: Baptized Paganism, thank you very much.

Pastor Ross: That's the one. If you'd like to receive that book Thomas, just give us a call. The number is 800-463-7297. No, actually that's the phone line here to the studio. 800-463-7297, and if you'd like the book the number is 800-835-6747. Call that number and ask for the book Baptized Paganism. Again that number is 800-835-6747. If you have a Bible question, 800-463-7297. Next caller is Aaron, listening from Carmichael. Aaron, welcome to the program. We have about a minute before the break.

Aaron: Oh, darn. Well-

Pastor Doug: You know what? We can finish your question after the break if you hang on.

Pastor Ross: Yes, ask the question and then we'll wrap it up when we come back.

Aaron: I was just going to ask about the term Elohim in the Bible. My understanding, is it means there's a plurality within God. It means that there's more than one person who's a God. I just want to traverse it, and explanation on that.

Pastor Doug: Well, you are correct. In Genesis 1 it says, "God said, let us make man in our image." The translators were very careful, and they found out that that word that was used for God there, God said let us, its a plural. Again you'll find that in Genesis 11, when God came down to the Tower of Babel. Hey, don't go very far away, Aaron. When we come back we'll take up that subject.

Aaron: Al right, thank you.

Ad: Stay tuned. Bible Answers Live will return in a moment. Amazing Facts through your faithful support, has had a major impact on some of the largest non Christian locations in the world. Beyond the Great Wall, the printing and translation of our books and videos materials are in constant motion.

[Chinese language]

The amazing fact Chinese language website is now one of our most visited websites. We also translated thousands of pieces of literature for these nations. What started out as hundreds of followers, is now in the hundreds of thousands. The impact of your funds invested in sharing the everlasting Gospel in these foreign lands, will be felt for years to come.

Pastor Doug: Every week, we hear the most incredible stories from all over the globe of lives that are being changed, and hearts that are being transformed by the power of the word. And none of it could happen without your teamwork with this Ministry. God bless you.

Ad: Did you know that Noah was present at the birth of Abraham? Okay, maybe he wasn't in the room, but he was alive and probably telling stories about his floating zoo. From the creation of the world, to the last day events of revelations, biblehistory.com, is a free resource where you can explore major Bible events and characters. Enhance your knowledge of the Bible, and draw closer to God's word. Go deeper. Visit the amazing Bible timeline at biblehistory.com.

Every Bible question you have answered moves you one step closer to the fullness of God's will for your life. What are you waiting for? Get the answers you need for a fuller, richer, more confident life. You're listening to Bible Answers Live. We still have a few pone lines open. If you have a Bible related question, call us at 1800-GOD-SAYS, that's 1800-463-7297. Now, let's join pastors Doug Batchelor and Jean Ross for more Bible Answers Live.

Pastor Doug: Welcome back listening friends. If you have joined us along the way, this is Bible Answers Live, and it is an international Bible study via radio and the internet you can participate in. If you have a Bible question, we do have lines open and have another half an hour to go. Number, 800-GOD-SAYS, that's 800-463-7297. One more time, 800-463-7297. We'll bring your question into the studio. I'm Doug Batchelor.

Pastor Ross: My name is Jean Ross, and pastor Doug, just before the break, we were talking to Aaron from Carmichael, California. Aaron you had asked about the trinity in the Old Testament, is that correct?

Aaron: Right. I was discussing with a friend who believes that only God the father is titled Elohim, but I explained there's a plurality. Thankfully he's been studying Hebrew and he learned that, but I'm just trying to find of other passages besides just Genesis 1:26.

Pastor Doug: If you don't mind, I'd like to give you a suggestion to approach this from a little different angle. He doesn't think that the Elohim in the Bible is the same as Jesus. Is that correct?

Aaron: Yes. He believes Elohim is God the father, and that Jehovah is Jesus. He's separating the two.

Pastor Doug: That's interesting. I've not heard that before. The Elohim and Jehovah are interchangeable later in Exodus. I was getting ready to give you all the verses that say that Jesus is also Jehovah, but it sounds like he agrees that Jesus is Jehovah.

Aaron: That's the thing. There's a verse and I can't remember what it is that's why I had to call.

Pastor Doug: Of course, The Bible says there is no savior but Yahweh, but that's Jehovah, and then the Bible says Jesus is the savior. Here you go. Here's what I would do. If you go to John it says, "In the beginning, God created--", I'm sorry in Genesis, "In the beginning, God created." right? And that's the Elohim. He agrees with that.

Aaron: Right.

Pastor Doug: You go to the gospel of John it says, "All things that were made, were made by Him", speaking of Jesus. If everything made, was made by Jesus, and if Genesis says, "In the beginning, God, Elohim, created." Jesus must also be Elohim. Does that make sense?

Aaron: Yes, that makes sense. I'll definitely tell him that, and I'm planning to send him a thing about the Bible. I have a book because he can't-- I've gotten really good at witnessing to him, and people like him, if that make sense?

Pastor Doug: Yes.

Aaron: I make sure that my resources are never anti their religion, if that makes sense?

Pastor Doug: Yes. Try and be supportive as you can, yet share the truth. We do have--

Aaron: And he believes that the Bible accurately translates as far as it's accurate, or it's accurate as far as it's accurately translated, if that makes sense?

Pastor Doug: Right. We do have a free book that we can send you on the subject of the Trinity. If you'd like a copy of that.

Aaron: Yes. I could copy it offline too. I got it early this week. The Trinity [unintelligible 00:33:27]

Pastor Doug: Yes. It's called The Trinity, is it Biblical? And these are quick studies, because when you share resources in a Bible study, if you get people a 300 page dissertation, you usually lose them in two pages. We try to make it simple. We give the overview of the arguments and give the references. Hey, appreciate very much Aaron your phone call. Hope that helped a little bit. Thank you.

Pastor Ross: Our next caller is Michael listening from Miami, Florida. Michael welcome to the program.

Michael: Hello, Pastor Doug, hello Pastor Ross.

Pastor Doug: Hi.

Pastor Ross: Hi.

Michael: I was having a discussion with a group of people not long ago about the [unintelligible 00:34:05] Sorry my dog is making noise. They were asserting to me on subject of Sabbath that Jesus Himself broke the Sabbath, so as to denounce Sabbath keeping in modern Christianity. The main verse that, one main verse that they cited for this was John 5, where Jesus healed the impaired man next to the pool Bethesda. And the Jews asked him, "Well who healed you?" And eventually he told them that was Jesus of Nazareth, and Jesus answered said, "My Father worked the Sabbath too, and I were."

In verse 18 it says, "Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill Him, because he not only had broken the Sabbath, but said also that God was His father, making Himself equal with God." The thing that I originally interpret that verse, was saying that the phrase that says that, [unintelligible 00:34:58] not only have broken the Sabbath, that was how the-- I also imagined that was just how the Jews were accusing Him, and they said He actually did break the Sabbath, but then I usually refute that with saying, "No, but John writes that verse also putting in affirmative that He said that God was His father." I guess they were trying to say that John was also affirming he's saying that He had broken the Sabbath.

Pastor Doug: John was agreeing that Jesus did break the Jewish leaders' Sabbath rules. Yes, Jesus did break their rules. He did not break the 10 Commandments. You never find Jesus in the carpenter shop, you do find Him healing on the Sabbath, and He said it's better to do good on the Sabbath day. Jesus never suggested that God stops healing people. If you cut yourself on Friday, the grace of God will continue to heal you through Sabbath.

The idea that Jesus broke the Sabbath, they also accused Jesus, and this is in Mathew 11:19, of being gluttonous, a winebibber, demon possessed, and a Samaritan. There was a number of things they accused Him of, and none of it was true. He did though break their Sabbath rules, and that's what John is referring to. He did not break the Sabbath Commandment of God. Jesus said, "You have set the Commandment aside that you might observe your traditions." They'd put the man-made rules ahead of the Commandments of God.

Pastor Ross: And then later on, when they actually came to Christ's trial, Jesus said to them, "Which of you accuse me of sin?" They couldn't nail Him on anything with reference to the 10 Commandments. It was just their man-made traditions until they had to come up with these false witnesses, and they didn't agree. Finally somebody said, "Well, He said He's going to destroy the temple and build it up in three days." That was not an accusation against Christ breaking the law. That was just nothing with reference to the 10 Commandments they could accuse Him of.

Pastor Doug: In the same gospel this to me I think is really clear. Jesus says in John 15, "I have kept my father's commandments." Obviously, the 10 Commandments and the Sabbath was one of His father's commandments. If sin is a transgression of the law, if Jesus broke the Sabbath, God's Sabbaths, not the man-made Sabbath, then He sinned, and how can He save us from our sins? The Bible says, "Who did no sin". I think that's a pretty weak argument, but I've heard it used before. You're still there Michael?

Michael: Yes, I'm right here.

Pastor Doug: If you've not seen it before, but it sounds like you may have, the new updated Sabbath Truth website. For friends listening, it really is the one-stop place. If you go to Google or Yahoo, it's the number one website on Sabbath information, because it's been so well, it's weathered so well with its documentation. Sabbathtruth.com has got just about any question that a person can run into on the subject, and the answer is there.

Pastor Ross: All right, if you have a Bible question, the number to call is 800-463-7297. If you have a Bible question, we'll get your call on the program tonight.

Our next caller is David, and he's listening from Arkansas. David, welcome to the program.

David: Hey fellas, How are you all doing?

Pastor Doug: Good. Thanks for calling.

David: This is a question on doctrine. It's a Bible question, but just a different interpretation of it. I was in a Bible study over the phone with my father and some other gentlemen. The subject of the doctrine of election by John MacArthur, are you familiar?

Pastor Doug: I am.

David: There's been a lot of debate over it over the past few nights I've been on the phone with these guys, and I'm getting more of an interpretation of it when I listen to it. I listen to about an hour sermon of it, of him with my dad and a couple other guys, like have a different interpretation of it I think, and I was just going to see if you guys had heard of it and what's your idea of it?

Before that, I argue with them about this or debate over it. They think that the whole idea of the elect, is God's already predetermined salvation for people. Nobody really has a choice on salvation. I feel like if I'm living wrong, and I need Jesus in my life, I start going to church. That's not my choice, God drew me near Him. It wasn't anything to do with me, because if it had been me, then that would be words, and you don't get saved by words. Their argument is you're only saved if you're chosen to be saved. Well, I am in conflict with this, with them. I'm kind of on the fence about it, so I was going to see if you guys-- and I've just-- I've stumbled across your radio station. I've never listened to the program before, and I've just [unintelligible 00:40:18].

Pastor Doug: We're glad you stumbled. I know that sounds strange from a Christian radio program, but we're glad you found us.

David: Well, I mean, I listen to Christian radio, but not at this time at night. I happen to be at work tonight. I wasn't supposed to work, but I drive a truck here locally, and I've been listening to the audio Bible, just the New Testament. I've been in the Book of Matthew, and I've seen a lot of verses that would contradict to what they think about salvation.

Pastor Ross: Before we run out of time, let me just dive in if I can, David. First of all, let me just say that John MacArthur is a good man. I expect to see him in Heaven. He's a good preacher. I don't know what particular sermon you listened to, but I do know his theology and know that he and I would respectfully disagree, as many Christians do. I mean, methodists and baptists are good people, but they disagree on the idea of once saved, always saved, and what we will call election, predestination, Calvinism.

Jesus said, "He that endures to the end, will be saved." The idea that once you are saved, you can't be lost. It really takes away the freedom of the individual, and God does not force us to be saved. God will never let go of us, but we are always free. We never at any point, lost that freedom. Now, a person can have security in their salvation based on the faith and the promises of God, but we do have a choice.

Pastor Ross: You know, another thought. In revelation, the theme throughout the book of revelation deals with worship. Two groups of people at the end of time. Those who worship God, and those who warship the beast. The difference between the worship of God and the worship of the beast, is that worship to the beast is a false worship. There are laws passed, that if you don't worship a certain way, if you don't receive the mark of the beast, you can't buy and sell.

God can never accept that kind of worship. The only worship God can accept is worship that is freely given. And, in order for us to be able to worship God freely, we need to have freedom of choice. We choose to worship him, or we choose not to worship him. Salvation is the same. We can choose to receive Jesus as our personal savior, or we can choose to reject him and not choose him as our personal savior. If we didn't have freedom of choice, then one might might argue, "Well, then God is the reason why there is sin in the world,and he is the one that has predestinated me to be lost, and there is nothing I can do about it. So, I might as well live the life of a sinner." And that's not Biblical truth, in the least.

David: Well, where I am tangled with the whole idea, is that I believe that anybody can come to Christ, that is lost and as a sinner and done horrific things in their lives, and then hear the word and then believe and then become saved. They accept Christ. And their argument was, "Well, if God wanted everyone to be saved, then he would, because God is all powerful and he can save everybody. And then he picks and chooses who he wants to be saved." Then they got into the area, the pot maker and the clay.

Pastor Doug: The potter and the clay, yes. And the potter can make whatever kind of vessel he wants.

David: Yes. They used that as a part of their argument on it was-

Pastor Doug: Paul never meant that to be used that way, because that would imply that God would choose to make a vessel sinful. And that almost makes God almost an accomplice in our crimes, because it is like saying, "I have no choice but to sin, because God made me this way." Even Peter said, "People have abused the writings of Paul to their own destruction." That's not at all what he means.

Hey, let me just give you a couple of more thoughts, because we've got some other callers standing by, David. If you look in the Gospel of John 15, where Jesus is talking about the vine and the branches. He says, "Every branch in me," those are branches in Christ, "That does not bare fruit, he takes away.And every branch that bares fruit, he purges itthat it may bare more fruit." The Lord will empower, the Lord will draw. When a person comes to Christ, they can't take the credit and say, "I became a Christian, because I did it on my own."

The holy spirit draws them. God is working to save, but we must respond, because otherwise it's not love. If we're 100% forced to serve God, it isn't love. And a person can resist the spirit.

Pastor Ross: Yes, one more verse. 2 Peter 3:9, "The Lord is not a slack concerning his promise," talking about the second coming. "Some men count slackness, but his long suffering towards us", and here is the point, "Not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance." There, the Bible is pretty clear, that God is not willing that any should perish. He hasn't predestinated and said, "Well, I choose you to perish and there is nothing you can do about it." God is not willing that anyone should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Not that all will, because they have the freedom of choice. We got that book that I think David might enjoy reading. It's called Can I save the man who choose to be lost? And we will be happy to send that to you, David. Just give us a call on our resource phone number. The number is 800-835-6747. And again, you can ask for the book called Can I save the man choose to be lost?, and we'll get that in the mail.

Pastor Doug: And, if he is driving, he can just go to the Amazing Facts website later, and probably download it.

Pastor Ross: Yes, amazingfacts.org. Our next call is Craig, and he is listening in Riverside, California. Craig, welcome to the program.

Craig: Hello, thank you for having me on.

Pastor Doug: Thanks for your patience.

Craig: I got a few questions, actually.

Pastor Doug: Well, let's take them one at a time.

Craig: Okay, great. The lineage of Christ through Adam and Eve. Now, I know, I believe I have seen something in the Old Testament, you know how it goes, "so and so be got so, and so and so", and I know, I just saw it in Matthew, where Matthew explains the lineage of Jesus Christ, but I want to see it all the way through and I'd like to patch it together in my Bible.

Pastor Doug: If you look in Luke 3:23, it traces the genealogy of Jesus all the way back to Adam. You will have an unbroken link there in the Gospel of Luke. Luke 3:23. It actually starts with Jesus and works backwards, but all that you've got to do is flip it upside down.

Pastor Ross: Yes, that actually ends in verse 38 and says, "And the son of Enoch, the son of Seth, the son of Adam, the son of God." It goes all the way back.

Craig: Great. Okay, wonderful. Gosh, thank you so much.

Robert: All right. Second question.

Craig: Okay, next question is, now, I heard this and I don't know the truth of it or not. I know when the flood came and destroyed the inhabitants of the Earth, there was something said about the commingling, and I don't know if this is right or not. The fallen angels, the giants baring children with regular people, and the flood was part of wiping out that bloodline, not to be mixed up with the bloodline of Jesus Christ.

Pastor Doug: Yes, that's often misunderstood. There is one verse there, and it's in Genesis 6, I think starts at verse three-

Pastor Ross: Verse two.

Pastor Doug: Verse two? And where it says, "The sons of God saw that the daughters of men that they were fair, and they took wives of all whom they chose." And they think the sons of God are angels, or maybe they were even aliens, or fallen angels, and they intermarried with humans, and had babies, and these babies were giants. That's not at all what is happening here. After Adam and Eve, Cain left and he took his wife, and they started their own civilization, that after hundreds of years, had thousands of people.

And the children of Seth, Cain killed Abel, but Adam and Eve had another son named Seth. The other kids of Adam and Eve and Seth, they stayed true to God. They were called the sons of God. The daughters of Cain, were the daughters of men. That Men meant mortals, or the ones who had rebelled. As long as they stayed separate, the sons of God were holy, the descendants of Adam and Seth. Then they began to intermarry, and that's all it's talking about.

If you look, for instance, in John 3:1 it says, "Behold what manner of love the father has bestowed on us that we should be called sons of God." Sons of God, are describing believers. When the believers intermarried with the unbelievers, God saw the wickedness of men was great in the Earth and he sent a flood. They did have children that had genetic vitality. They were giants, but they weren't aliens. They weren't half demon. Now, some of the movies love to make it look that way.

Pastor Ross: The whole idea, this is a fairly recent idea, that talking about the sons of God as being angels, the daughters of men as being humans. It's a fairly new idea that came about by a bad paraphrase of the Bible, where it actually, somebody put their own thoughts into that and said, "Well, these are angels and these are humans", but that's not the original Hebrew. That was a paraphrase that became rather popular in the last 30, 40 years.

Pastor Doug: Yes. And you read the old commentaries, they are all really clear that is intermarriage of two separate groups of humans that had stayed separate. I’ve got a book on this we’ll send Craig for free on, angels, alien, or adopted, Who are the Sons of God?

Robert: The number to call is 800-835-6747 that is the resource phone number the book is called Who are the sons of God. Again, that's 800-835-6747. And the book is called Who are the Sons of God. You can read it also at the Amazing Facts websites, which is amazingfacts.org. Our next caller is a Horace listening from Brooklyn, New York. Horace, welcome to the program.

Horace: Yes, thanks for hearing me out. Sounds like you’re contending that there is a Sabbath lesson to man? Is that correct?

Pastor Ross: Well, the 10 Commandments, last I checked it was still there.

Horace: Did you know that the Hebrews 4:8 says, we all know that God did give rest at the beginning of the earth, but if Jesus had given them rest, when he [unintelligible 00:51:12] afterwards spoken on another day.

Pastor Doug: Who do you think that Jesus says that it's speaking of there in Hebrews 4:8?

Horace: Jesus, I don't know of any Jesus but the son of God.

Pastor Doug: Okay, that's what I was wondering. That word there, Jesus-- hang one second. The word there in Hebrews 4 when Paul says Jesus, that's the Greek word for Joshua. Paul is talking about when Joshua led the children of Israel into the promise land. If Joshua had given them rest by leading them into the promise land, David would not have spoken of another day later in the book of Psalms. If you look at most translations, you'll see that and that verse isn't saying Jesus gave us a different day of rest.

Horace: Yes. It said, "If he had given us rest afterwards." Well, let me give you that you are saying that that we still have the 10 Commandments that was given. The law and prophets were until John.

Pastor Doug: Let’s talk about that Horace. Do you believe God wants us to keep the 10 Commandments?

Horace: It was given, and he required us to keep it forever and forever, and when Jesus said it is finished on the cross.

Pastor Doug: Do you think-

Horace: He fulfilled the first dispensation of law and prophesy.

Pastor Doug: Do you believe it's okay to kill?

Horace: No.

Pastor Doug: How about steal?

Horace: No, but remember that Jesus said, "A new commandment I give unto you, and that you love your brother and-"

Pastor Doug: If you love your brother and you love God, will you keep the 10 Commandments?

Horace: It means that these two commandments substantially incorporates all the rest much but you're not required-

Pastor Doug: Is lying okay?

Horace: Pardon me.

Pastor Doug: Is lying okay?

Horace: Lying?

Pastor Doug: False witness.

Horace: No.

Pastor Doug: You agree that we should keep all of the 10 Commandments?

Horace: No, because it had to be fulfilled.

Pastor Doug: Well, you only have a problem with one commandment it sounds like.

Horace: Let me slow you. Are we still burning an offering? Are we still killing a lamb, and are we still stoning people to death when they transgress?

Pastor Doug: Well, we don't keep any of the ceremonial laws anymore but–

Billy: Did you know he also said, "Not one jot or tittle of my words shall fall to the ground until all these is fulfilled." If all is not fulfilled, you can’t stop anything.

Pastor Doug: Hang on one second here. If we go to that quote there in Matthew 4:19, he says, "Whosoever shall think to change the laws", it said, "Not one jot or one tittle, no wise pass from the law." Actually, in Luke, he doesn't even say, "Till all is fulfilled. Whoever therefore, will break one of the least of these commandments he'll be spoken of as least in the kingdom of heaven. But whoever will do and teach them, he will be called great in the kingdom." Horace I apologize, you can tell from the music, we're getting pushed off the airwaves. We do have a free offer that deals with written in stone, we’ll send you a copy and amazingfacts.org, or call the line. God bless friends. We’ll be back in just a moment.

Ad: Thank you for listening to today's broadcast. We hope you understand your Bible even better than before. Bible Answers Live is produced by Amazing Facts, a faith-based ministry located in Sacramento, California.

Pastor Doug: I love the quote, "The greatest want of the world is the want of men. Men who will stand for the right though the heavens fall." Yet, studies are showing for several years now, the secular media and culture have sought to portray men as the family idiots. Sadly, respect for the role of fathers and husbands, has reached an all-time low. Now, as dispirited men abandon their roles of godly leadership, it's not surprising that we’re experiencing a moral free-fall in our country. That’s why starting September 30, I’ll be presenting a new program called Mighty Men of God. Using biblical principles, this encouraging four-part series will address how to be a loving father, faithful husband, and all-around man of God in the family church and nation. Please plan now and join me for this live event and learn from the word how to live courageously for the King.

Ad: If you'd like to enhance your study of God's word, visit our website at www.amazingfacts.org, and sign up for our free Bible study course, and make sure to check out our online bookstore at AFbookstore.com, which offers thousands of inspiring books, DVDs, and more, to help you get the most out of God's word. To take advantage of the offers you've heard on this broadcast, call us at 800-835-6747, or visit our website at amazingfacts.org. Did you enjoy this program? Make sure to tell your family and friends. Tune in next time for more Bible Answers Live. Honest and accurate answers to your Bible questions.

Pastor Doug: Have you ever heard the expression before, "They eat like a bird." Talking about somebody that has a minuscule appetite? You might want to think twice next time you use that expression. For example, take the hummingbird, in order for it to maintain it’s incredible metabolism, it has to eat about 50% of its body weight every day. To put that in perspective, if a hundred-pound woman was to eat like a hummingbird, she would have to eat 50 pounds of sugar a day just to maintain her body weight, imagine that. Maybe you don't want to imagine that, but perhaps you want to consider this another way.

The hummingbird typically consumes between 4 to 7 calories a day. On the other hand a human, about 3500 calories a day. If you would eat like a bird, a hummingbird, you'd have to eat over 150 thousand calories a day. That’s like a man 170 pounds that would be 3000 Oreo cookies. Under normal conditions, a hummingbird needs to eat every five or 10 minutes, but there is actually one time during the year the hummingbird will eat its entire body weight every day.

You see, once a year, they make this migration 500 miles across the Gulf of Mexico, from Texas to the Yucatán Peninsula. In order to do that, the hummingbird feast on nectar and gorges themselves on this nectar for about a week doubling their body weight. That’s the only way they can store enough calories to help them with their 70 wing beats per second, or roughly 4 million wing beats on that journey.

On the same way friends, as we near the end of time, we need to be feasting and gorging ourselves on the nectar of God's word. We’ve got to be able to have that strength to get us through the times of trouble that are ahead. When it comes to the vital and your personal devotions, if you’re going to eat like a bird, eat like a hummingbird.

For over 50 years, Amazing Facts has shared the wonderful news of salvation and provided millions of Bible resources to people all over the world. We’ve built churches in India, proclaimed God's word in China, and have sent free Bible studies around the globe. Today's program and free resources were made possible by our ministry partners, caring individuals like you. If you've been blessed by Amazing Facts, would you please consider partnering with us to reach others with Bible truth. Your financial support today will help keep programs like this on the air. The blessings you've received can be shared with others. To find out more about becoming a ministry partner, please visit our website at amazingfacts.org.