Spinning Out of Control

Date: 10/04/2015 
On February 1970, First Lieutenant Gary Foust was conducting practice maneuvers near the Malmstrom Air Force Base in Montana, when his F-106 Delta Dart aircraft suddenly entered an uncontrollable flat spin. As the jet spiraled down from 35,000 feet, Foust tried everything in the book to regain the control. Just after Lieutenant Foust was commanded to eject at 12,000 feet, miracle of miracles, the aircraft recovered itself and headed off flying straight and level towards the horizon. From his des
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Pastor Doug: Hello friends, this is Doug Batchelor. How about an amazing fact? On February 1970, First Lieutenant Gary Foust was conducting practice maneuvers near the Malmstrom Air Force Base in Montana, when his F-106 Delta Dart aircraft suddenly entered an uncontrollable flat spin. As the jet spiraled down from 35,000 feet, Foust tried everything in the book to regain the control. Just after Lieutenant Foust was commanded to eject at 12,000 feet, miracle of miracles, the aircraft recovered itself and headed off flying straight and level towards the horizon. From his descending parachute, all Foust could do was watch helplessly as its fighter jet flew off without him.

The pilot touched down safely and was soon located. About an hour later, the Air Force Base received a phone call from local law enforcement saying they'd found a fighter jet in the middle of the field without a pilot, and the engine was still running. The plane had managed to make a perfectly smooth landing, skidding 400 yards in the snowy meadow without significant damage. The wayward aircraft was repaired and returned to service.

Friends, has your life ever felt like it was spinning out of control? Stay with us, we are going to learn more as Amazing Facts brings you this edition of Bible Answers Live.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to Bible Answers Live with author and evangelist, Pastor Doug Batchelor. Is understanding God's word a challenge? Are there passages or scripture that are a mystery to you? Maybe it's difficult to reconcile what you've read in the Bible to what you've always believed. If you have Bible related questions, stay tuned to get honest, practical answers straight from the word of God on Bible Answers Live.

Bible Answers Live is a production of Amazing Facts Ministries dedicated to spreading the gospel of Jesus Christ to the entire world. Our lines are open, call us now at 800 God says, that's 800-463-7297. Now, here's your host, Pastor Doug Batchelor.

Pastor Doug: If you have a Bible question, we have some lines open and it's a free phone call. That number, 800-835-6747 will bring you into the studio. You're listening to Bible Answer Live and this is a live international interactive Bible study, and we especially deal with Bible questions.

We don't have all the answers, but we've got a number of Bible programs on our computers open before us and we'll do our best to search the truth together. That number again is, 800-835-6747 or 1-800 God says brings you into the studio. God bless and my name is Doug Batchelor.

Pastor Shawn: My name is Shawn Rose. Good evening listening friends and Pastor Doug, let's begin the program with prayer.

Dear Father, once again, we thank You that we have this opportunity to study Your word. We'd like to invite Your Holy Spirit to come and fill our minds as we search the scriptures. Be with those who are listening, wherever they might be and lead us together Lord into a clearer and fuller understanding of Your word, for we ask this in Jesus name, Amen.

Pastor Doug: Amen.


Pastor Shawn: Pastor, you opened the program by telling a rather remarkable fact of a jet fighter plane that landed itself. Now, that might not sound too astounding to some today because we have computerized systems. We have drones, unmanned planes that fly around but when this plane landed, they weren't the type of electronics and communications that were available today.

Pastor Doug: No. Typically, if a plane went into a flat spin and the pilot ejects, it's just going to be a pile of rubble, it'll create a crater on the ground because it just goes into totally uncontrolled free fall. One of the things he did as it was spinning is that he trimmed it and he tried everything and just before he ejected, something about the inertia from the ejection corrected the final problem. It took off flying straight and level all trimmed until it gradually hit a meadow that had just the perfect slope to dissipate the force and it glided in. I think it's skidded up the bottom a little bit but didn't hurt the wings.

When the police came, they called in and said, "There's a jet here with the engine running." and they said, "How do we turn it off?" They said, "Just let it run." It ran another hour and 45 minutes. [chuckles] Anyway, this just makes me think about God's providence and how sometimes we think that everything is totally out of control. God can have His hand guiding the ship even when we don't think we've got control. It reminds me of that verse that maybe friends, you listening are wondering, "Is my life pre-planned?" or "Is everything in control?" God sits on the throne but He promises He can work things together for good when there is a problem.

You find that in Romans 8:28, "We know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose." Some are wondering, "Does that mean that since God can work things together for good, that he's already decided if we're saved or lost or we have a choice?" That's not what this verse is saying. This verse is saying when things happen-- because of the devil's meddling in our choices-- God when we surrender to Him, He can work those circumstances together for good but everybody still has a choice on whether or not they follow God.

Some choose to follow God and then they choose to turn away. Maybe you'd like to understand more about how does God's providence? how much does it control in our lives? or how much choice do we have? There's a free offer we have that deals with this very deep and interesting subject.

Shawn: We have a book and it's entitled, Can a Saved Man Choose to be Lost? and that is our free offer for this evening. We'd be happy to send it to anyone who calls and asks. Our resource number is, 800-463-7297. Again, that number is, 800-463-7297 and you can ask for the book, Can a Saved Man Choose to be Lost?. We'd be happy to send that to anyone who calls and asks. We're also streaming this program live over the internet tonight. If you're close your computer you can join us via the live stream here at the studio. It's live.amazingfacts.org, and you can be a part of the program here as well.

We're going to have the phone lines our first call is Christopher and he is listening from Baltimore, Maryland. Christopher, welcome to the program.

Christopher: Hello, how are you?

Pastor Doug: Doing good, thanks for calling. Your question tonight?

Christopher: I'm [unintelligible 00:07:03] The Book of Job, it's one of my favorite books in the Bible. I have a question, Job threw all his turmoil. His wife told him to curse God and die. After, he lost all of his children and lost all of his health and his possession. At the end of the story, he had more than what he had in the beginning, he even had more children. What I want to know is, were they by the same woman, the same wife or did he remarry?

Pastor Doug: It's a good question. I've wondered that myself, Christopher. It tells us that we can understand the devastation that Job's wife felt when she not only lost all of her possessions or husband loses his health and she loses all of her children. At the end of Job's ordeal which probably lasted a matter of weeks, it says, "God removed the curse and began to bless him again." In the process of time, presumably after some years went by, it says he had more children. He had seven sons and three daughters and his daughters were the most beautiful in the land. People have wondered, his wife told him to curse God and die.

Did he have this whole crop of new kids from her? Certainly, it's possible. They lived a long time back then and they had children, their bearing years were much longer. Sarah still was having children when she was 90, that of course, was unusual. The other possibility is she died and he remarried. The Bible is silent on that, it's a good question. We just know that he did have a lot more children and not hearing otherwise probably by his wife. I appreciate your call Christopher, thank you very much.

Shawn: Our next caller is Kevin and he's listening on Radio 74 from Alaska. Kevin, welcome to the program.

Kevin: Good evening gents. How are you tonight?

Pastor Doug: Evening.

Kevin: I have a quick question because I really enjoyed your sermon on Salt. I went to my concordance and I found six verses, Genesis, Judges, Job, Matthew, Galatians and James. They don't have one that you mentioned in the sermon itself. I was hoping you could give me a few more examples over to use that I might be able to look because it made a really good point that I liked.

Pastor Doug: Which verse was missing? Was it the one about the Covenant of salt or--?

Kevin: I've got Genesis 19:26, Job or Judges 9:45, Job 6:6, Matthew 5:13, Colossians 4:6, and James 3:12. [inaudible 00:10:08]

Pastor Doug: You know I'll-

Kevin: [unintelligible 00:10:09]

Pastor Doug: Well, Kevin just to be honest with you, you're referring to a sermon I preached probably several years ago that was rebroadcast, I don't have the notes of that exact sermon, I've got all the references to salt, salt’s mentioned 43 times in the Bible in 37 different verses, I just looked it up. Many of the times it talks about the salt sea, meaning the Dead Sea. I couldn't tell you which ones are missing from my particular sermon without my notes in front of me. I know some of by memory.

Kevin: [unintelligible 00:10:40] what I’m most interested in is the points to us being the salt in our duty I found it [unintelligible 00:10:49] juries [unintelligible 00:10:49] angels and on the salts of the judiciary in my mind. I wanted to find some verses to go along with that.

Pastor Doug: You'd mentioned the one in Colossians 4:6, it says, “Let your speech always be seasoned with grace, be with grace, seasoned with salt that you might know how to answer each one.” and I think it's referring back to what Job says, "Is there any flavor in the white of an egg?" Meaning, that some things are flavorless. I don't know what tofu would be like without salt, it'd be pretty bland. Some things don't have a lot of flavor and salt brings it out, and the Lord wants us to have personalities that are flavored with grace and kindness and I think that's what he's referring to. The only other thing I could suggest is if you email us at Amazing Facts, I'd be happy to send my sermon notes, I still have them.

Kevin: Very good and then I get to break through them and find out what stood out in my mind, it was just a flash passed me and then I was listening to the rest of the sermon and I just didn't catch it, but it was a really good point that I wanted to be able to put on my website.

Pastor Doug: I sure appreciate that, I’ll have to just admit in the 20 years I've been at my current church I've preached literally hundreds of sermons, if you figure there's 52 weeks in a year and more than half of them on preaching and no two sermons are exactly the same and I've got notes from most of them, but well I don't even remember at this point what [laughs] I've said. I do have the notes on that, I'll have to dig it out and send it to you, but I appreciate your question Kevin, glad someone's watching.

Shawn: We have Michael who is listening from New Jersey. Michael welcome to the program, actually listening to WMCA radio, Michael you're on the air.

Michael: Pastor Doug, Pastor Rose I got two quick questions but I want to thank you for your service.

Pastor Doug: Pleasure, thank you for calling and your question?

Michael: I want to know what the seven's Holy Spirit is.

Pastor Doug: Where it talks about the seven spirits of God in Revelation?

Michael: Yes.

Pastor Doug: The best answer that I've got is, if you go to Isaiah 11:-- I'll do verse one and two, it's a prophecy about the Messiah and it says, "They'll come forth a rod from the stem of Jesse," -- Jesse, of course, was the father of David-- “and a branch shall grow out of his roots.” Speaking of Jesus the Messiah, he is the stem of Jesse, the seed of David “And the Spirit of the Lord will rest upon him.” All right, that's one, the Spirit of the Lord, the Spirit of wisdom; that's two, Understanding; three; Counsel, four; Might;-

Michael: God's abduction.

Pastor Doug: -five;Spirit of knowledge; six; Fear the Lord; seven.

Michael: Amen.

Pastor Doug: And the way I've divvied this up anyway, there are seven facets of the personality of God the spirit and like James says, “If any man lacks wisdom let him ask of God." What wisdom is one of the gifts of the Spirit that he gives us? Understanding, Counsel, Might or Courage is a gift of the Spirit. That satisfied me that it's talking about the different facets which God demonstrates his spirit.

Michael: And the second question is -- Oh, wait a minute now, I got it right in my head. -- Only two people for my studies have faced Satan, face to face, am I wrong am I right?

Pastor Doug: Well you've got Joshua the high priest and--

Michael: I'm wrong, okay.

Pastor Doug: And then you've got, of course, Jesus, who was the other one you're thinking of, Paul?

Michael: I'm thinking of Eve.

Pastor Doug: Oh, Eve? There's probably been others in the Bible. The Bible says Satan tempted David and it specifically what calls him the adversary but I think that word is Satanists in the Greek Old Testament. When David numbered Israel talks about Satan specifically got involved in that, but I'm sure the devil has through history.

Michael: But I'm talking about scripturally; the word, I just want to make sure.

Pastor Doug: Satan is scripturally mentioned in the story of David there are seven Devils that said that we know Paul, but that is not specifically Satan. We know Satan tempted Jesus and like you said, Eve and then there's a parable of vision where Satan is accusing Joshua the high priest and Zechariah and I forget what that-- it might be Zechariah four, but anyway, I hope that helps a little bit, Michael. I appreciate your question and thank you for calling.

By the way, friends, if you do have a phone call, that number once again is 800 God says, that's 800-463-7297. Got a confession, at the top of the program I was giving out our resource number instead of our regular number, if you want to call into the studio it's 800-463-7297.

Pastor Shawn: Our next caller is Sharon. Sharon is listening to WWIS in Wisconsin. Sharon, welcome to the program.

Sharon: Good evening. Thank you.

Pastor Doug: Hi, get real close to your phone.

Sharon: Okay, thank you. I was raised to believed to confess my sins to another person [chuckles] another sinner like myself. And then, as a young adult, I've read scripture that only God can confess-- I mean, can forgive my sins. I’m just wondering in Mathew 1:21, where the Angel told Mary and Joseph to name the baby, Jesus because He shall save his people from their sins. I’m wondering if the name, Jesus, means savior or forgiver?

Pastor Doug: The name Jesus is-- of course, when you read the New Testament, you're reading the Greek pronunciation. In Hebrew, his name is really Yahshua, in Greek, it comes out Jesus, or something close to that. Mary never leaned over the bassinet and called him the crib, or the manger, she never called him Jesus, as we're seeing it now, she probably called him Yahshua, which is actually the exact same name of Joshua in the Old Testament, same name, Yeshua.

That name means Yahweh. Yahshua is Savior or Yahweh is salvation, that's why the angel said, "You'll call his name, Yahshua. For He will save his people from their sins."If you want to be more literal, that's the way Jesus name is pronounced and his name means, Jehovah is Savior.

Sharon: Savior from our sins.

Pastor Doug: Yes, it matched up perfectly. Anyone reading that in the original or in Hebrew would have understood it or if it was an Aramaic, he would have understood that his name meant, Savior. A lot of the names in the Bible meant different things that it seemed to fulfill their personalities. Daniel means, my God is judging and Jacob, his name meant deceiver and he was tricking everybody the first part of his life but then he had a change of character and God gave him a different name, which means, overcomer with God, Israel.

Names mean a lot in the Bible, now we pick names based on how they sound, we get a baby book and we sound like the sound of that or it's going to make grandpa happy but they thought a lot about the meaning in Bible times. Thank you very much, Sharon, hope that helps.

Pastor Shawn: We have Phil who is listening from Grand Rapids Michigan on XM 131. Phil, welcome to the program.

Phil: Hello, thanks for taking my call.

Pastor Doug: Absolutely.

Phil: My question is this, do you believe that after a future tribulation period, there's going to be a thousand year period where Jesus will rule and reign on planet Earth in person?

Pastor Doug: No, there's two views among Christians about the Millennium; one view is that the righteous and the wicked are dwelling together with Jesus ruling here on earth during the 1000 years; the other view is that we live and reign with Christ in heaven and the New Jerusalem comes down at the end of the 1,000 years. I think Pastor Rose and I fit in that second group, where we see that the condition of the Earth after the Second Coming is desolate, you find that in Isaiah, it says, “I'll turn the world upside down.” Jeremiah says “All the cities are broken down and there is no man after the coming of the Lord." That’s Jeremiah 4:23 and you can read where Jeremiah also says, "The slain of the Lord will cover the earth from one end to another and no one will be there to mourn or bury them." We know we’re caught up when the Lord comes, the dead and Christ rise, the living are caught up, we meet them in the air. Jesus said, "I’d go to prepare a place for you and I’ll receive you under myself." and he takes us to those mansions he has prepared "and the New Jerusalem descends down to earth." Revelation 21. We believe that’s the conclusion of the 1,000 years.

It says in Revelation 20, “At the end of the 1,000 years, the wicked are raised” and this is great judgment, the New Jerusalem descends. That’s a quick overview of the study, we believe that during the 1,000 years, we’re off in heaven with Christ and we have a free study that’s got all these scriptures in it plus many more Phil, would you like that?

Phil: Sure. Would I be correct in saying that you do believe in a post-tribulation rapture?

Pastor Doug: Yes, we believe the rapture happens after the tribulation. That’s why Jesus said, “He that endures to the end will be saved.” The seven last plagues are the tribulation and in the same way that the children of Israel were in Egypt during the 10 plagues that fell on Egypt and God saved them through those tribulations. We will be on earth during the seven last plagues but he preserves us, he says, “No plague will come near your dwelling.” God says, “Our bread and water will be sure”. And at the end of that time, we’re delivered just like the Israelites were delivered at the end of the plagues. For that many other reasons, we do believe that we’re on Earth and that God will save us, not from, but through the tribulation.

Pastor Shawn: That study guide that you mentioned again is called Thousand Years of Peace and we’ll send it, Phil to you or anyone who calls and asks. Our resource line is 800-835-6747, that’s 800-835-6747. Ask for the study guide of Thousand Years of Peace and if you have a Bible question, the number to call here to the studio is 800-463-7297. Our next caller is TJ and he is listening from Lincoln, Nebraska. TJ, welcome to the program.

TJ: Hi there. I was wondering about Daniel 8:14, “Unto 2300 days then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.” I was basically wondering, how do we know for sure when the starting date is?

Pastor Doug: That’s a good question. It’s an interesting prophecy because, at the end of Daniel Chapter 8, it says, before the angel can finish telling him everything, he passes out. and it says, “And I fainted.” and that’s Verse 27 and “I was sick for days. Afterward, I rose and went about the king’s business and I was astonished by the vision but no one understood it.” He doesn’t know the starting point, starting point is not given yet. Then you keep reading Chapter 9, he's praying, the angel comes back to him and it says, “I have come now to give you understanding”.

In Daniel Chapter 9, the angel gives him the starting point. He says, “From the going forth of the commandment to restore and build Jerusalem unto the Messiah, the Prince.” The starting point for both the 2,300 day prophecy and for the 490 year prophecy or the 70 week prophecy telling when the Messiah comes, there’s only one starting point given, it’s the final command, and that command, by the way, is in the Book of Ezra, I think it’s Chapter 7, Mr. Rose?

Pastor Shawn: Ezra 7, you can read from Verse 1 all the way through the Verse 26.

Pastor Doug: It’s the command of Artaxerxes to rebuild Jerusalem and that was 457 B.C. Yes, I believe that’s the starting point for both prophecies.

TJ: All right. Thank you very much.

Pastor Doug: Absolutely. Hey, you know we’ve got a study guide on that. That’s a great question and I think it’s called God sets the date for the Judgment, is that right Pastor Rose?

Pastor Shawn: I think it’s Right On Time.

Pastor Doug: Right On Time. Thank you.

Pastor Shawn: To get that study guide, just give us a call on our resource line TJ, it’s 800-835-6747. We have a study guide called Right On Time that looks at Daniel 8:14 and also these time prophecies in Daniel Chapter 9. I think we have time for one more caller before our break, we have Michael who is listening from Kentucky. Michael, welcome to the program.

Michael: Hi. How are you doing today?

Pastor Doug: Doing great, Michael. What’s your question tonight?

Michael: My question is, do you know where in the Bible that talks about in-- let me go to my Bible right quick. -- You know where it says, "[unintelligible 00:24:57] they will have deceiving spirits."

Pastor Doug: Where they’ll have the what? What spirits?

Michael: Let me go into the--

Pastor Shawn: Deceiving spirits, is that what you said?

Pastor Doug: The Bible talks about devils in Revelation that the three uncleaned spirits like devils go out to deceive the Kings of the Earth.

Pastor Shawn: That’s Revelation Chapter 16:14.

Michael: [unintelligible 00:25:20] in the First Timothy.

Pastor Doug: Watch out for seducing spirits in First Timothy?

Michael: Yes.

Pastor Doug: What’s your question about these deceiving spirits?

Michael: About the food-- actually, could people eat the unclean [unintelligible 00:25:42]

Pastor Doug: I know. I understand what you’re saying. You’re wondering about that statement that Paul makes in-- is it the First Timothy, where he says in the last days, deceivers will come saying, commanding to abstain from meats, they’ll be seducing the spirits and saying, you can’t marry and command into abstain from meats which God has created to be received with thanksgiving of them but no one believed the truth. I want to be careful not to be too specific or be unkind but there is a prominent church in the world that tells people they can only eat-- do you have that verse?

Pastor Shawn: Yes, it’s First Timothy, Chapter 4:3.

Pastor Doug: Why don’t you go ahead and read it.

Pastor Shawn: Forbidding to marry and condemning to abstain from meat which God has created to be received with thanksgiving of them who believe and know the truth.

Pastor Doug: There’s a large church in the world that tells their pastors they can’t marry and they say, you’re not supposed to eat certain foods on certain days of the week, like maybe fish on Friday or something. There are certain things that God has created to be received with thanksgiving. Then he goes on and he says, "Every creature of God is good and nothing is to be refused if it’s received with thanksgiving for it sanctified by the word of God and prayer."

Paul goes on to say, there are foods that are sanctified by the word of God in prayer, Paul is not saying that some have taken this first that that gives Christians permission to eat any kind of food no matter how healthy, good or bad, clean or unclean it might be, just say a prayer over it and you know you could-- Christians don’t have to worry about cholesterol, Christians don’t have to worry about sugar, just pray over it. And so that verse has been abused and so that has nothing to do with clean or unclean food that God specifies in the Bible.

It’s really talking about a deceptive religious institution that we’ve come about. See, in Paul’s day, there was also a problem with them telling the Jewish converts that they couldn’t eat even the clean meats that have been sacrificed to [unintelligible 00:27:54].

Speaker: You’re listing to Bible Answers Live.

Pastor Shawn: You know Pastor, just before our break, we’d like to let people know that we have a great resource, that Amazing Facts has just released it's heart ot of the press. Actually, heart of the duplicator, it is the new DVD series entitled, Revelation: the Bride, the Beast in Babylon.

Pastor Doug: Absolutely. We’ve worked, [chuckles] I think we’ve worked for 1,260 days, 42 months and three and a half years on this project and it is a great study. We’ve never done anything this long, it’s 90 minutes and it goes all the way from the birth of Christ and it follows the prophecies that you see in Revelation 12 and Revelation 17. The one about the Bride of Christ, you find in Revelation 12 and the woman who is called Babylon that you see in Revelation 17 and it explains who is the beast, who are the bride and who is Babylon.

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That you see in Revelation 17 and it explains who is the beast, who are the bride and who is Babylon. Friends, this will really open your eyes. Go to revelationmystery.com. revelationmystery.com, watch the trailer. We’ll be back in just a minute.

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Speaker: Bible Answers Live will return in just a moment. If you’re looking for Bible-based materials for further study, sign up for Amazing Facts' free correspondents Bible Study Course or check out our sales catalog featuring hundreds of inspiring books and tapes. To order, call our resource line at 800-835-6747. That’s 800-835-6747. Amazing Facts is a faith-based listener support administry operating exclusively through the generosity of your prayers and financial gifts. We would love to hear from you, write to us at P.O. Box 909, Roseville, California, 95678 or online at amazingfacts.org.

You’re listening to Bible Answers Live with Pastor Doug Batchelor. If you have a Bible related question, call us now to receive clear and honest answers directly from scripture, we have a few lines open. Please give us a call, the phone number to the studio is 800 God Says, that is 800-463-7297.

Speaker: If you've enjoyed Bible Answers Live you'll love Pastor Doug's Book of Bible Answers straight from the broadcast the very best question and answers have been compiled as an awesome resource for study and personal evangelism, each answer has been expanded with more Bible verses and insightful commentary. The Book of Bible Answers can be yours today for just $12. Call now 1-800-835-6747 and request offer 257 that's 1-800-835-6747.

Pastor Doug: We are back and we are live and if you have a question this program is going to be dedicated to try and answer your Bible questions. We've been doing this now about 17 years and we still hear new questions in every broadcast, don't be afraid to call in with your Bible question. It's a free phone call, lines are still open 800 God says, that's 800-463-7297, ready, one more time 800-463-7297 brings you into the studio and I am Doug Batchelor.

Pastor Shawn: My name is Shawn Rose, we are going to go straight to phone lines, we have Richard who is listening in Canada in Manitoba. Richard, welcome to the program.

Richard: Hi, thank you.

Pastor Doug: Hi.

Richard: Hi, I had a question that pertains to the teaching of the investigative judgment, I was wondering where Jesus went when he made his public ascension-

Pastor Shawn Rose: Well-- All right. Keep going I will let you finish.

Richard: And also, I was wondering if the throne of God movable, because Hebrews seems to say that he went right into presence of God and Ezekiel has his prophecy about the wheels turning, it looks like the throne of God is movable, in Daniel 7th he seems to sit down on his throne that it moves. I am wondering if the Father and the Son made this movement together in the transition from the holy place ministry into most holy place ministry.

Pastor Doug: One thing I will tell you is there is at least one example in the Bible of-- a couple of them if I kind think of, of mobile thrones. Jehoshaphat had a throne in Jerusalem and he went down to see Ahab they set throne from down there. It wasn't unusual whenever a monarch sat in some kind of hearing that they gave him a throne but when Christ first ascended to heaven, he went right into the holy of holiest to have his sacrifice declared, that's why he told Mary don't cling to me, I've not yet ascended to my father and he said, "Go to my brother and then say, I ascend to my father and your father my God in your God." Then at the end of Sunday afternoon, he has come back down to Earth and said, "All hail."

And then, he received the worship. Somewhere between the time he rose from the grave and Sunday afternoon when he met with the apostles, he went into the presence of the father no doubt into the holy holies and his sacrifice was declared successful and victorious. Then at the end of 40 days, for 40 days he continued to appear among the disciples and and instruct them and encourage them and 10 days before Pentecost he ascended to heaven and he began his work on our behalf as a high priest working on what we would think of as the first apartment of the heavenly sanctuary. Those things are hard for us to picture because the scope of them is so much more awesome than anything on Earth.

Pastor Shawn: Just to add to that, we find in the Old Testament, God saying to Moses, "Build me a sanctuary so that I may dwell amongst my people." and then sanctuary on Earth is a shadow or type of the heavenly and once the completion of the sanctuary was made that was fully built, then we find Moses going and sprinkling blood sort of setting the sanctuary apart and he did so in the Most Holy place, and then we find a high priest ministering in priest ministering in the first compartment throughout the year until the day of devil torment when he went into Most Holy place.

And so we find in the ministry of Jesus Christ as Pastor Douglas mentioned ascending up to heaven, he gets the approval from his father that his sacrifice was sufficient and then he ministers on our behalf in the first compartment of the holy place and then we find a transition at the end of 23,000 days of Daniel 8:14 when Jesus ministers in the Most Holy place, and I think it's accurate to say that God's throne moves. We find in Daniel 7, the ancient of days entering in and he is seated upon the throne in the Most Holy place and then one like under the Son of men that would be Jesus entering in before him.

Richard: Is there a veil separating two compartments? I am wondering because Jesus has no danger being consumed in the presence of the Father as did the regular priests did, is there really--?

Pastor Doug: Hebrew seems to say that the veil is removed in Jesus, now that doesn't mean there isn't any kind of heavenly architecture that distinguishes the first from the second room. but on Earth, they had to veil the presence of God to-- because man was simple, to keep him from being consumed, but obviously, Jesus doesn't need to be veiled from the presence of the father. That veil was to-- not only was a barrier showing that there's two different rooms but I think the veil was more to protect the priest when they went into the holy place from the presence of God. Great question, we have a lesson actually as the arch of the covenant on the cover of the lesson and we'll send you a free copy of that.

Pastor Shawn: That study guide is called God drew the plans. I am going to send to you for free, Rich or anyone that calls and asks. The number for our free offer is 800-835-6747 and again the study guide is called God drew the plans. We have Alex who is listening in Florida on WTLN. Alex, welcome to the program.

Alex: Yes. I want to thank you [unintelligible 00:36:15] ministry.

Pastor Doug: Get real close to your phone, Alex.

Alex: My question has to do with the first act of Jesus will rule with the iron fist. Because at the end of the thousand years, where does he and when does he [inaudible 00:36:41] with an Iron fist?

Pastor Doug: Okay, it doesn't actually say, we heard pretty bad echo, we are going to bring down your audio. It doesn't actually say, "He rules with an Iron fist." It says he rules with a rod of Iron and it's probably what you are referring to, you can find that first in Psalms 2:9, you'll break the with a rod of iron and Revelation 2:27, he will rule a rod of Iron, they'll be dashed to pieces. It says that the bride of Christ bring forth a male child who is to rule all nations with a rod of Iron, Iron was the strongest metal they had back in Bible times. Brass, you hit it hard enough and then a bronze or brass [unintelligible 00:37:20] would bend or break, but Iron could break all of the others, that's why that image has got feet of Iron or legs of Iron, it was a symbol of strength.

That's why David when he had Goliath sword it was an Iron sword and when a king had an Iron Scepter, it was symbolic of that it will break everything else. Iron broke the clay, it could dent the Gold. Iron was considered to be the most powerful scepter and they were probably embedded with jewels, so that's my understanding. Shepherds carried rods to chase away the jackals; the enemies of the sheep, and like the road of Moses and rod of Aaron, the idea that God will have a rod of iron meant strength.

Pastor Shawn: We also find specifically in Revelation 2:27, where he talks about Jesus coming to rule with the rod of Iron, that says he breaks the wicked as pots of clay. That, of course, is a reference to Daniel 2 when you have a stone cut out without a hands that strike the image of feet and iron and grinds all of the metals to powder and the wind comes and blows it away, it's a symbol of the second coming of Christ. And Jesus, the good shepherd is coming to the defense of his sheep. Because just before Jesus comes there is a dead decree according to Revelation 13, but before the death decree can actually be carried out Christ come to the deliverance of its sheep the good shepherd come to defend his sheep with a rod of Iron.

Pastor Doug: Hope that helps a little,Alex. I appreciate your question. Who do we have next?

Pastor Shawn: We've got Ken, and he is listening in Vallejo, California. Ken, welcome to the program.

Ken: Good evening.

Pastor Shawn: Evening.

Ken: My question has to do with-- I've been taking a Correspondence course and on biblical interpretation and I have gone through the early books of Pentateuch and all that. I've had a question arising out of divorce because there's been quite a bit of that in our family. The provision that was allowed in the old testament law that allowed for divorce under certain circumstances, adultery and so forth. I've heard discussions that the Christ canceled that out and took it back to Adam and Eve and apparently canceled that out saying it was because our hearts were evil that they were allowed to have divorced. I just wondered I'd like to get some clarification on that because the situations where people are abandoned or where there's extreme violence in a marriage, what a person is to do?

Pastor Doug: All right, that's a big subject. Before I delve very deep, Ken into answering that, we get this question so often and it’s such an important question that about a year ago, I completed a book. It's called Marriage Divorce and Remarriage. If you call Amazing Facts, we'll send you a copy. It's got the scriptures and the principles. Let me give you -- one of the most popular verses you would study on that is Matthew 19. It says in verse 7, “The disciples said, why did Moses give a certificate of divorce to put away a wife?”

Jesus said in verse 8 in Matthew 19: 8, “Because of the hardness of your hearts permitted he you to divorce your wives”. From the beginning it was not so, and whoever divorces his wife and of course wife husbands same thing except for sexual immorality.

Jesus still made the provision that if there's marital infidelity, if they divorce and marry another they're guilty of adultery. Whoever marries her or him, who is divorced without biblical grounds commits adultery, because they sort of become an accomplice then. Jesus did say marriage is very sacred. What God has joined together let not man put asunder.

Paul explains you'd talked about what about abandonment or what about if there's some kind of physical abuse? Certainly. If a person is in a situation where their life and health is being threatened or endangered, they ought to separate immediately from that and start processing if there's potential for counseling and recovery.

If not, they should remain separated, especially if there's children in the situation. Abandonment, that creates a lot of other problems. After a while, some spouses, typically men, but not always will abandon a wife and children and they don't have any contact, no idea where they are. Years go by and they wonder, "Am I destined to spend the rest of my life alone?" or "Can I have this annulled and get remarried?"

I really think they need to bring a pastor in and get some good biblical counsel on that. Paul talks in first Corinthians 7 about if there are two unbelievers or two Pagans and one accepts Christ and the unbeliever then says, “I'm leaving you. I didn't want to be a Christian”. Then that person who is left or abandoned, they may be free to remarry. It says they're not under bondage in such cases.

Ken: Was that first Corinthians, is that 7?

Pastor Doug: Yes. The whole chapter deals largely with those marital issues.

Ken: Okay.

Pastor Doug: Paul is not talking about two believers who suddenly decide they're incompatible. He's talking about -- because Paul was going and preaching throughout the Gentile world and many were accepting Christ. When they accepted Christ, their Pagan spouse would say, “Look, I worship Jupiter. I don't want to be married to a Christian. I'm leaving you”. Then they'd come to Paul and say, “Look I accepted Christ and my husband or my wife left me. What do I do?”

He said, "Do everything you can to win them back. You might have a sanctifying influence on them. Try to save the marriage. If there's any redeemable qualities -- I'm paraphrasing -- save the marriage, but if they depart and there's nothing you could do. You're not under bondage, in those cases. It's implied that you're free to accept the consequences of the divorce that you can't help and remarry."

Ken: That one passage that you mentioned in Matthew 19, I am familiar with that passage. I wasn’t familiar with that one part there where you said that he allowed divorce in some case of adultery. Is that how that's written in all Bibles?

Pastor Doug: Yes, I read it just like -- you also find it yeah in regular King James Bible, Matthew 5 chapter 32. Jesus says the same thing.

Ken: Okay, 5:32, I’m going to write that down. I’m going to go to Matthew 5:32.

Pastor Doug: Go to Matthew 5:32.and you'll see it there as well. Thank you very much Ken, and don't forget that you can request that book. Anyone listening out there, we trust you'd find it a blessing Marriage Divorce and Remarriage. What Does the Bible Say?

Jean: The number to call for that is 800-835-6747 and you can just ask for the book Marriage Divorce and Remarriage. We'll be happy to send that did anyone who calls and asks. We have Michelle who is listening from Loma Linda, California. Michelle, welcome to the program.

Michelle: Hi, I just had a question. I've been giving Bible studies to my cousin regarding the investigative judgment and also the millennial judgment. She brought up a text in Matthew 19:28 regarding that we will be judging the twelve tribes of Israel. Her point was saying, that means that we'll be judging innocent people. I just wanted to know what the actual interpretation of that is.

Pastor Doug: That's a good question. I think that of course in heaven, when it says the 12 apostles are going to sit on 12 thrones judging the twelve tribes, our idea of judgment is always you know people are coming with a problem and you're saying, “Yes, this one's innocent, that one's guilty”. I think that judges Biblically were also people who are teachers. When you think about the judges in the Bible, like Deborah was a prophetess and she was called a judge.

While they did sometimes settle disputes, Moses was a judge. He did a lot of teaching. I think in heaven the 12 apostles who had this close relationship with Jesus, they're going to be talking about the character of God and it means they'll be sitting in positions of honor. Judges were considered you know one of the highest positions of honor. They're obviously

not going to have people coming and saying, “This guy stole my chicken in heaven and how did we divide that chicken now?” and stuff like that.

Michelle: Yes, okay.

Pastor Doug: Pastor Rose?

Jean: Yes, I think the verse she’s talking about there, in Matthew 19:28, I think it extends past the thousand years in heaven and even continues to the new earth. It says there Jesus said, “I should they I say unto you, in the regeneration when the Son of man sits on the throne of his glory, those of you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones”. We know that for a thousand years, the redeemed are on heaven but at the end of that thousand years, the New Jerusalem comes down.

It's that point that God creates a new heavens and a new earth after the wicked are finally destroyed. We also know from Isaiah that the righteous actually build their own houses and they will scatter out from the big New Jerusalem, that glorious City. As life continues throughout eternity, it appears as though there are different responsibilities that will be involved. Again as Pastor Doug says I don't think it's judging guilt and innocence because that's already been done. They will hold some position of leadership it seems in the earth made.

Michelle: I see. That makes more sense. It gives me a broader picture of it.

Pastor Doug: We do have a lesson, we'll send you for free that deals with Facing the Judge. It talks about Bible and judgment, just call and ask for that.

Jean: The number to call is 800-835-6747 and the study guide is entitled Facing the Judge. We’ll be happy to send that to anyone who calls and asks for it. Julio is listening from Roseville, California on KFI. Julio, welcome to the program.

Julio: Good evening.

Pastor Doug: Evening, and your question tonight?

Julio: I don’t see what the Bible tells me about -- I'm struggling with a drug addiction. I want some studies or some help with the Lord to break this bondage with my drug addiction.

Pastor Doug: All right, first thing I want to tell you, Julio is that we have a free study guide series that we’ll send you, we’ll either send it in the mail, you can call and request it or you can look at it online. If you go to -- there's a website called Bible Universe, they're free online. We have them in about ten different languages. You do these Bible studies, there's power in the word that will change your life. I used to use drugs and alcohol and smoked cigarettes and everything else. The Lord saved me.

The power of his word can just totally set you free and give you a purpose. What the Lord will do for you is God will give you what you're really looking for in the drugs. You’re looking for some satisfaction and you're looking for something exciting, when you find out how exciting it is to know about eternal life and God's plan for you and that you can share this with others, you're going realize I've got to get off the drug so I can get on the real thing.

Julio: Amen.

Pastor Doug: He'll give you encouragement. It's a transformation of your mind. That begins by humbling yourself just giving yourself to God, repenting of your sins, saying, Lord, I'm sorry and inviting him to take control of your life. By the way, it talks about that in Romans chapter 12 verse 1 how you can present yourself just a living sacrifice and invite God to renew your mind. He will renew your mind. He can heal your mind.

Julio: Amen.

Pastor Doug: I've got friends I know that we're just so strung out on drugs they couldn't even read anymore and now they're teaching the Bible.

Julio: Amen. I believe that. Thank you.

Pastor Doug: All right. If you go to that website Bible Universe and then you can get the free study guides. Can I pray with you, Julio?

Julio: Yes sir, absolutely.

Pastor Doug: Father in heaven, we just want to pause right now and I want to pray for Julio and others like him that might be struggling with some kind of addiction whether it be drugs or alcohol and they want to be free. Lord, I pray that you'll just send your spirit into their minds and hearts and set them free, help them to experience your power right now and a transformation. Show that you're real Lord, I pray this in Jesus name. Amen.

Julio: Amen. Thank you.

Pastor Doug: All right Julio, God bless and we hope to hear a good report.

Pastor Shawn: We have Sharon who's listening from Detroit Michigan. Sharon, welcome to the program.

Sharon: Hi.

Pastor Doug: Hi and your question?

Sharon: My question is, I'm confused about the curses that God said he would send upon three to four generations, if the three or four generations is cursed before coming out the world, what type of chance do [unintelligible 00:50:30] under that criteria with the generation, what type of chance will we have ever been Born again Christians and walking with the Lord as we are ready cursed from our ancestors?

Pastor Doug: You're not cursed and this is often misunderstood, the Lord is very clear and Pastor Rose might help me look this up and it is in Ezekiel where it says the Son will not bear guilt for the sins of the Father, is that Ezekiel 18? I'll let you look that up and I'm going to read in the Ten Commandments, Sharon if you look in Exodus chapter 20 he says, “Don't make any graven images a likeness of anything in the heaven above or the earth beneath or the water under the earth, don't bow down and serve them, for I the Lord your God am a jealous God here it is visiting the iniquity of the father's upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of those that hate me, notice showing mercy to thousands of those who love me.”

Now when it says there's a curse on the generations up to three and four generations, it means the bad behavior of parents is often modeled and adopted by the children and it may go on two or three or four generations before they develop a new cycle, it's not saying God is not waving his wand or putting some curse on people and saying because your father's bad, I'm going to curse you, because the Bible says God doesn't do that. God is saying you need to be careful about your behavior because you will model and pass that behavior on, it's often true kids see their father abusing their mother, there's a much higher case of them growing up and being abusive to their spouses.

Sharon: Right and then that go along with the other caller [unintelligible 00:52:20] when you smoke then she will smoke.

Pastor Doug: Exactly. My parent's smoke, I started smoking. But I decided by God's grace to break the cycle, I quit smoking and my kids don't praise God. You know what I'm saying you need to just do your best by God's grace whenever anyone accepts Jesus, you can break that cycle of the generational curses that are passed on by behavior and you can create a new model that's because you're a new creature and you're born again. Did you find that verse?

Pastor Shawn: I did yes, Ezekiel chapter 18 verse 19 says that “The Son is not to be the guilt of the Father.” That's Ezekiel 18 verse19 and 20.

Pastor Doug: All right, thank you, Sharon, hope that helps a little and we have time for maybe one more before winding up here.

Pastor Shawn: We’re going to go to Rose who is listening from New York, New York. Rose, welcome to the program.

Rose: Hello, can you hear me?

Pastor Doug: Hi Rose, how are you doing?

Rose: I had Bible class yesterday, some believed that we can live a perfect life without ever sinning because when we sin it's a choice that we make and they used the verse that says, “We can do all things through Christ who strengthens us.” Now, I disagree and I wanted to know what you thought.

Pastor Doug: All right, I want to send you a book and I read this book I was actually flying cross country, I put the plane on autopilot, I was on radar and I read this book in the air and it's called Is it possible to live without sinning? It is a very good book, it was written by someone who does not claim to be sinless, I don't claim to be sinless, I don't think Pastor Rose does. But the question is, do we believe that with God's power he can help us overcome every sin? That's a different question. Do we believe that it's God's desire for us to be like Jesus who was sinless, are there any Christians out there who claim sinlessness? I don't know any and I'm very scared of anyone if I've ever met people that claim that that scares me.

We become perfect when we accept the righteousness of Jesus and our goal is to be Christ-like and he was perfect, you see what I'm saying, Rose?

Rose: Right.

Pastor Doug: Chances are before the sun goes down, most of us make mistakes but we should not settle for anything less than doing our best by his grace to be like Christ who was perfect and sinless. Don't be discouraged when you fall, that's why Paul says, "If any man sin we have an advocate with the father." This book has a really good balance, anyone out there listening, it'll really challenge you when you read this book, a full of Scripture. Is it possible to live without sinning Rose, I hope you'll send for that book and we'll be happy, it's free and we'll be happy to send it to you.

[musical background]

I knew that music was going to sneak up on us. Hey, friends we want to thank you for tuning in and I want to thank our Amazing Facts volunteers in the studio and our program being engineered tonight by Molly Lynch, keep in mind we are on the air because of you, we don't get subsidised by any organization or denomination or deep gold reserve we have somewhere, it's because folks like you enjoy the program keep us on the air. Send us a note at amazingfacts.org, tell us you enjoy the program. God bless till next week.

[orchestral prelude]

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