Trials & God's Providence

Date: 11/27/2016 
Jason and Jenny Laurence from Midlands, England, decided to spend their holiday in New York City. Unfortunately, their vacation happened to land on September 11, 2001 when the World Trade Center was attacked and nearly 3,000 people perished. Rattled by their 9/11 experience, they thought next they’d vacation a little closer to home and just went down to London.
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Advert: Welcome to Bible Answers Live where you’ll get honest answers to your Bible questions. Let’s face it. It’s not always easy to understand everything you read in the Bible. With 66 books and more than 700,000 words, the Bible can generate a lot of questions. If you’d like answers to your Bible questions, you’ve come to the right place. Now, here’s your host, Pastor Doug Batchelor, President and Speaker of Amazing Facts.

Doug Batchelor: Hello, friends. Would you like to hear an amazing fact? Jason and Jenny Laurence from Midlands, England, decided to spend their holiday in New York City. Unfortunately, their vacation happened to land on September 11, 2001 when the World Trade Center was attacked and nearly 3,000 people perished. Rattled by their 9/11 experience, they thought next they’d vacation a little closer to home and just went down to London.

That was on July 7, 2005 and it turned into the day when four British suicide bombers attacked London subway in the bus network. On that occasion there were 52 deaths and 700 people injured. For their holiday in 2008, Jason, a sales agent with a metal plating company and Jenny a dental laboratory worker, thought it might be more peaceful on the other side of the world. They decided to vacation in Mumbai, India.

You guessed it. On the night of November 26, when the city was attacked by terrorists and 180 people were killed. It seems that Jason and Jenny had knack for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Have you ever wondered of some people are just naturally unlucky? Stay with us, friends. We’re going to learn more as Amazing Facts brings you this edition of Bible Answers Live.

Advert: You're listening to Bible Answers Live. Honest answers to your Bible questions. Our phone lines are now open. If you have a Bible related question, call us at 1-800-GOD-SAYS. That’s 1-800-463-7297. Now, let’s join our host, Pastor Doug Batchelor and our co-host, Pastor Jean Ross.

Doug: Welcome listening friends to Bible Answers Live. And this is a program where we study the Bible together. If you have a Bible related question, then give us a call. We do have several lines open. Good time. Give pick up your phone right now. Let me give you the number again for your Bible questions, 800-GOD-SAYS, 800-463-7297 or you could say 463-7297, or several other derivatives of that. My name is Doug Batchelor.

Jean Ross: My name is Jean Ross. Good evening listening friends and Pastor Doug, let’s begin the program with a prayer. Dear Father in heaven, once again we are grateful for the opportunity to just spend a few moments studying the Bible together and we ask for your Spirit to come and lead our hearts and minds. Be with us listening, Lord, and lead us into a clear understanding of the Bible, in Jesus Name. Amen.

Doug: Amen.

Jean: Pastor Doug, you opened the program by talking about two individuals which seems to have [laughs] terrible luck not only to be in New York City on 9/11, but then also one of the biggest terrorist attacks in London, to be there that day, and then this terrible thing that happened in Mumbai, India. You think those folks would probably be afraid to leave their yard [laughs] in case something else would happen.

Doug: When they were interviewed they said there are a lot of tourism agents that would pay them not to come to their country because it looked like bad. We laughed when they said it was terrible just to be at those places during those times when there was nonstop news coverage in all three cases. They just said it’s just the way it happened. And some people hear these stories and they think, “Is that a coincidence? What are the odds of a person being at two of those events while they're on a vacation, let alone three?” That’s just a pretty remarkable.

But I’ve often heard people say, “Well, they were just unlucky and or someone is lucky.” And does the Bible say that there is really such a thing as luck? Luck would imply that it’s just a happenstance or coincidence, but according to the Bible, God has everything in his hands and there's nothing that can happen providentially that doesn’t have a reason behind it. Nothing is just happenstance. That doesn’t mean if a list of bad things happened to you that you are cursed.

There's a story in the Bible called Job, where here’s a man who just had a terrible string of bad luck. What you would call bad luck. We use that as a figure of speech. But he just lost his family, lost all his possessions in one day. What are the odds of having three different attacks from different nations stealing your cattle and lightning hitting your sheep? Just all this one day and then have all -- Lose all your health on another day.

But you look behind the scenes and you realize there was providence who work in me. Good and evil. There was a providential event happening behind the curtain in the life of Job, but it wasn’t bad luck or good luck. And the Bible tells us in Deuteronomy Chapter 28, “That if we follow the Lord, He promises blessings.” And some people it seems like, “Well, everything they touch does well.” Well, they may be blessed by God.

Joseph went through a string of bad luck and then he had a series of very good experiences that came, and it was God’s providence working through all of that. And then if we’re disobedient, you might think, “I’ve just been unlucky.” Well, you might be missing the blessings of God because your life is out of his will. Deuteronomy 28:15, Moses, this was his last sermon. He said, “It will come to pass, if you do not obey the voice of the Lord your God, to observe carefully all of his commandments and his statutes that I command you today, that all these curses will come upon you and overtake you.

Cursed you will be in the city and cursed you will be in the country. Cursed you will be your basket, you kneading ball. Cursed will be the fruit of your body and the produce of your land, and the increase of your cattle, and the offspring of your flocks.” And it goes on. I won’t read it all. Sometimes people are wondering, “What is going on. I'm going through these trials. Is it the devil attack in me like in Job’s case or is it that God is maybe trying just chastises me through this obedience? Or what is happening providentially?”

We’ve got a book that we think will bring you some encouragement about a person who went through some terrible trials, but God turned it all for good. And Pastor Ross, why you didn’t tell us about that?

Jean: Yes. We have a book and the book is entitled Deathwatch in Siberia and it’s really a great testimony on how the Lord working an individual’s life even though in through trials, and this is our free offer for today. If you call us on our resource phone number, we’ll be happy to send you the book called Deathwatch in Siberia.

The number to call is 800-835-6747 and you can ask for the book Deathwatch in Siberia. The number again is 800-835-6747. And if you have a Bible question, the phone line here to the studio is 800-463-7297. Again, that’s 800-463-7297. Well, we’re ready to go to the phone lines. Our first caller this evening is Britney listening in Bakersfield, California. Britney, welcome to the program.

Britney: Hi, I'm good.

Doug: Hey, thanks for calling. Your question.

Britney: Yes. Okay. My question was those who are rises when the second coming comes and they go to heaven, will they know their family members or what happens when you go to heaven and also a family member went as well?

Doug: Well, it’s a good question because, first of all, we think that when we get to heaven, grandma who may have been in her 90s and a little bit shriveled up when she died, and you think, “They're going to get a glorified body, how will I recognize them and how will they recognize me when the last time grandma saw me I was 10 years old and now person dies 50 or the Lord comes?” Do you think that when we get to heaven our abilities of discernment will be better or worse than they are now?

Britney: Probably better.

Doug: Yes, I agree. Don’t you think we’ll have the Holy Spirit that will also help us to discern and see not just to what a person looks like, but because we’re going to be spiritually enhanced, we’ll see who they are on the inside or just have the spiritual connectivity that we don’t have now because of sin?

Britney: Okay. Yes. It makes sense.

Doug: Now, let me give you a verse. If you look in 1st Corinthians Chapter 13, it says, “Now, we look through a glass darkly, but then we’ll see face to face. Now we know in part, but then we’ll know even as we are known, we will know as we are known.” Our knowing each other is going to be enhanced in heaven. I think I vaguely remember, Pastor Ross’ some other verses on that. I can’t remember right now, but I think there are several verses that say that we will know our loved ones in heaven.

Britney: Thank you. That answered my question perfectly.

Doug: All righty. Thanks so much. I appreciate your call, Britney. Thanks for your patience.

Britney: Thank you.

Jean: We do have a book talking about the second coming that I think, Britney, you’ll find interesting or anybody wanting to learn more about what happens when Jesus comes again, because the big thing is there is this glorious resurrection and the righteous are resurrected to life. The book is called Anything But Secret. And if somebody could give us a call on our resource phone number, we’ll be happy to send that to you. The number is 800-835-6747, and you can ask for the book called Anything But Secret. Again, that's 800-835-6747. Our next caller is Jerry listening from Medford, Oregon. Jerry, welcome to the program.

Jerry: Hello, Pastors Ross and Batchelor. My question pertains to Apostle Paul. Prior to his conversion, he is a very conservative and orthodox Jew. The Romans were very despised occupiers of that territory. What prompted Paul to become a citizen? You think by so doing, he would've been persona non grata amongst his friends.

Doug: I don't think that Paul applied to become a Roman citizen. The way I read it is because of his father's citizenship in Tarsus, that he was somehow awarded citizenship. I think Paul, because Paul said he was being interrogated by, and Pastor Ross might have to help me look this up in Acts when Paul was arrested during that riot. The Roman soldiers said to him, "Are you Roman?" He said, "Yes." The Roman soldiers said, "Well, my freedom came at a great cost." Paul said, "I said was born free." Meaning that he inherited it through his father somehow.

Some Jews, not just Jews, but some Roman citizens around the kingdom, because of their status or position, their job in the government, they were awarded citizenship as Romans. They got the rights. It's like people immigrate to America and they become full-fledged Americans based on certain things. Yes.

Jean: That's Acts 22:28 is the reference.

Doug: Okay. Great. I don't know if that helps, Jerry. Was that what you're looking for?

Jerry: Yes, I didn't think about that particular scripture you mentioned, about the fact that his father was most likely a Roman citizen.

Doug: Yes, he's called Saul of Tarsus, because while he studied at the feet of Gamaliel in Jerusalem, he was sent there. He was, I think, born in the Asian Greek province of Persis there where his mother and father were, I'm guessing, one of them was a citizen, probably his father and he just inherited it. He was born into it.

Jerry: Okay. Well, thank you very much.

Doug: All righty. Thank you. Appreciate your question. Good question. Never heard that before.

Jean: If you have a Bible question, the phone line here is 800-463-7297. That's 800-463-7297 and that'll bring you here to the studio with your Bible question. We have some phone lines that are open, a good time to pick up your phone and give us a call. Our next caller is Clint listening from Florida. Clint, welcome to the program.

Clint: Hello. Can you hear me?

Doug: Yes.

Clint: Hi. Yes. My question is concerning Jesus. In the New Testament, there's plenty of reference to Jesus being sinless, of course, and without sin. My question is what is the best verse in the Old Testament that says that the coming Messiah will be sinless or without sin?

Doug: Well, I've got an answer for you, but before I give it to you, I'm just curious what is instigating that question? Because one at the New Testament be adequate? Are you working with a Jewish person?

Clint: No. I'm actually writing, and I guess this is another question since I got you on the phone. I'm trying to write, and what is your opinion since you ask, a Biblical fiction story based on a story in the Bible, based on a character in the Bible, but it's taken place in the time.

Doug: Yes, historical fiction, Bible-based historical fiction.

Clint: Right. My question is, in a conversation in the story that these people are having, he is talking about the Messiah that has just been born, and he discusses with this person that the Messiah will be sinless. He doesn't have the New Testament [crosstalk]

Doug: Yes, I get it. That's a good- It's interesting. Now, I'm interested in your book. Here is the verse that I have, and Pastor Ross may have some others, is the prophecy in Isaiah 53 talks about the Messiah being a sin-bearer. The only way that he would have a right to bear the sins of others is if he did not have sin. Otherwise, he has to suffer for his own sin. But he suffers for ours. That's Isaiah 53. There's a lot of verses. You can read the whole chapter there. You're probably acquainted with it.

Clint: Okay, yes. That's a good one. I appreciate that.

Doug: There may be others. I think that there's some prophecies that says there is no other savior than God. Now, you and I know it.

Clint: I guess there's one that I found that says that he will be -- the verse that says there was no deceits found in him or something like that. Is that another one that would be reference to him being sinless? I'm not sure where-

Doug: I'm trying to think of there that is. I think I know what you're talking about.

Clint: Yes, [unintelligible 00:15:13] there was no deceits found in his mouth or something like that. I'm not sure if that's, I'm not quoting that exactly but-

Doug: That may be Isaiah 53 also. We'll take a look there and read that chapter, and you may find that there. Now, you said you had a second question.

Clint: Second question, the actual about the —well, I guess the second question was in your opinion, is it okay to write Biblical, like take a story from a character in the Bible and actual stories in the Bible and then embellish them in a fictional way because you're elaborating on the stories, like embellishing it, but you know what I'm saying? Using your imagination to draw out the story. Is that, in your opinion, how do you feel about that?

Doug: Yes. I think as long as you're clear-- First of all, you wouldn't want anything in the story to conflict with known verses of the Bible. I wrote a book on Mary Magdalene. As you're filling in the details and you're trying to make the book readable, you have to sometimes creat visuals and conversation. Every Pastor does that when we talk about some of the history of the Bible. I'll preach on Rahab. I'll try and create a picture of what it was like when she was going through our community and saying, "If you want to survive when Joshua comes, you got to be in my house because I got the red rope there."

Your pastors are always trying to fill in the picture for people, but you want it to be consistent with the Bible. I think for redemptive purposes, sometimes, some sanctified imagination and trying to help people to picture the stories in the Bible can be appropriate, it can be useful. You don't want it to get too wild. As long as you're coloring in the lines of scripture, I think that there can be some useful ways to tell Bible stories. I think parents do with their kids all the time.

If you just read what the Bible says, then you don't ever need a preacher [laughs] to elaborate or build, or bring to life some of these stories. You just read the Bible to them. But because we sometimes appreciate people bringing it to light, yes, I think it's okay to do that. Hey, thank you very much for your question Clint. I appreciate it. We got another line open. We’d love to hear for you.

Jean: The number to call is 800-463-7297. That is the phone line here to the studio with your Bible question. Again, 800-463-7297. We've got Steve listening from Michigan. Steve, welcome to the program.

Steve: Hello, Pastor. Salaam Aleikum.

Doug: Hey. How are you?

Steve: Blessed and highly favored. Thank you. How are you?

Doug: Likewise.

Steve: All right. Absolutely, only way to be and only answer to ever give. My question for you this evening is I'm wondering why there's such a controversy and such a big problem with Baptism. I’ve read the Bible several times, I've studied it intensely, and I noticed that the scripture Acts 2:38 versus Matthew 28:19, Peter stands up on a day of Pentecost and tells them men and brother, but they asked Peter the question what must we do to be saved? Peter tells them to repent, be baptized in the name of Jesus or you're sure for the remission of sins and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Right there, he tells them that they must be baptized in Jesus' Name.

Now, you go back to Matthew 28:19 and it tells you, “Go ye therefore in all the world, baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost.” What I've found and believed to be true, and correct me if I'm wrong please, is that if you obey Acts 2:38, you have fulfilled Matthew 28:19. Because Matthew 28:19 are nothing more than titles. There is no name in there at all. If you're baptized that way, you're baptized wrong.

Because Peter stood up and told how the baptism was supposed to be done. Okay? And by obeying that particular one, you have fulfilled Matthew 28:19 because Peter gives the name. Because there's no other name given under heaven whereby we must be saved.

Doug: All right. Of course in Matthew 28, I don't think that if a person is baptized in the Name of the Father, in the Name of the Son, and in the Name of the Holy Spirit, their baptism is somehow invalid. Because in Acts, it mentions the baptism three different ways. I think once it says, “In the Name of the Lord,” once it says, “In the Name of the Lord Jesus,” once, “In the name of Jesus Christ.” The wording’s a little different and there's four different wordings, but it's really clear that they're being baptized in the name of the one God, which we know consists of God the Father, the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.

I do have a book, Steve, that talks about the name of God and it goes into the declaration of when someone's baptized and we’ll send you a copy of that. But just before we talk to you about the book, I think everyone needs to know that when a pastor marries somebody, there is a lot of ways that the wording could be done at the wedding. I'll meet with a couple before they get married and I'll say, “Now, when we do the vows, do you want me to use your full official name? Do you want me to say Jean Fowler Sylvester the third? Or do you want me to say do you Becky marry Jean?” You make it very simple.

Either way the pastor says those names, as long as the witnesses of the Covenant understand what's being said and they agree, then it's a legally binding covenant and that would be true with baptism. If someone gets baptized in the name of the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit, and they're talking about the God of the Bible and they all know who they're talking about. In our church we baptize in the name of the Father, in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, in the Holy Spirit, I think it's valid.

Now, since Jesus specifically mentioned the Father and the Spirit, I wouldn't want to leave that out. We try to cover all the basis. but I would never tell a person their baptism is invalid because maybe they mispronounced the name of God during the baptism. I remember one time I had a friend, he was baptized and someone, is a Spanish candidate and he wanted to try and baptize them in Spanish, wife pastor friend didn't speak Spanish very well. I think he meant to say, [Spanish language] and he got mixed up and said [Spanish language], which is the Pope [laughs] or potato, papa's also potato.

I think the Angel laughed at that time but everyone knew, all the witnesses knew that this man was being baptized in the name of the Lord. God has a sense of humor at times like that ,but his baptism was still official.


Jean: We have a book called The Name of God and we’ll be happy to send this to anybody who calls and asks. If you have questions about The Name of God, about baptism, the number to call is 800-835-6747 and you can ask for the book called The Name of God. We’ll be happy to send it to anybody who calls and asks. You can also go to the Amazing Facts website, you can read the book right online for free. Again, the book is called The Name of God. If you have a Bible question, the phone line here to the studio is 800-463-7297. 800-463-7297.

Our next caller is Veronica listening from New York. Veronica, welcome to the program.

Veronica: Hi.

Doug: Hi, thanks for calling.

Veronica: Good evening, thank you. I have a question on tithing. At one point, I had this confliction with my husband who supports his mum in another country where there was no money whatsoever except everything we have. We’re talking about hundreds and hundreds dollars a month going over there. I'm not mad at that situation, however, I was a little guilty that I couldn't tithe properly as a result of that. When I ask different people, they say different things and then someone said to me, “Don't you remember when Jesus overthrew the tables and talked to the Pharisees and said, “Why aren't the young people helping their elderly, and why are you pushing this pressure on them to give to you?”” I’m like, [laughs] “Oh, that sounds like me.” I don’t want to twist it and I'm just wondering, when you have circumstances like that where you really have to help your family members and it could be whatever you could do, whatever-

Doug: Are you wondering-

Veronica: and you feel like you-

Doug: -are you wondering if the-

Veronica: -if you should-

Speaker1: - supporting of the-

Veronica: Pardon?

Doug: Are you wondering is supporting of the parents somehow eclipses or as a substitute for tithe or?

Veronica: Yes, I'm asking that question also and if I don't do it, I might not tithe. I want to say if I just give as much as I possibly can and not because I know then on a regular basis, this is what I doing for it-

Doug: Are you-?

Veronica: - for our family.

Doug: -are you and your husband both working?

Veronica: I tried to do both and it's really very difficult for me.

Doug: All right, do you and your husband both work?

Veronica: We used to and my husband got ill, and he now has security and the kids have it ,and a little bit extra because they have vast flak and stuff like that, but –

Doug: Are you and your husband both Christians?

Veronica: Yes.

Doug: All right and so do you both believe what the Bible says about tithing?

Veronica: Yes.

Doug: Then because they're and it's important of course to honor your mother and father, but if you had 20 kids and you had that responsibility, that does not exempt you from tithing, does it? I know you don't have 20 kids.

Veronica: [unintelligible 00:25:34] yes.

Doug: Family obligations I don't think becomes a substitute for trusting that God will make 90% goes farther than 100% because He says He'll bless it. It doesn't make sense and it takes faith. But we have a study we can send you on that Veronica that will cover that subject and it's free.

Veronica: Terrific.

Doug: It's called In God We Trust. If you just call the resource number, Pastor Ross will give you then ask for that, and we’ll send you the study guide; In God We Trust.

Jean: The number to call is 800-835-6747, you can ask for the study guide called In God we trust. Again, that number is 800-835-6747. If you have a Bible question, the phone line here to the studio is 800-463-7297. We have David listening from Atlanta, Georgia. David, welcome to the program.

Doug: David, you’re on the air.

David: I'm a long time listener, this is the first time calling. My question when in discussion with people from other denominations, the topic is how some are against denominations they preach, about absent from the body is present with the lord. And some people take it that means when you die, your body goes to the ground and your spirit goes to heaven. Then there’s others that think whenever we die, we go into a rest waiting for to be called up with the first and last will be caught up to the Lord.

My question is, is it a doctrine difference between the denominations of the teaching is why that is that way?

Doug: Well, a lot of people misunderstand the verse in the 2nd Corinthians chapter 5 where it talks about absent from the body and be present with the Lord. First of all, I was discussing this with a gentleman today at the health club. If a person dies and they’re saved, and their body, of course, turns into dust, their next conscious thought is being in the presence of the Lord.


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Man: Every Bible question you have answered moves you one step closer to the fullness of God's will for your life, so what are you waiting for? Get the answers you need for a fuller, richer, more confident life. You are listening to Bible Answers Live. This broadcast is a previously recorded episode, if you'd like answers to your Bible related questions on the air, please call us next Sunday between 7:00 PM and 8:00 PM Pacific time. To receive any of the Bible resources mentioned in this evening's program, call, 800-835-6747. Once again, that's 800-835-6747. Now, let's join pastors Doug Batchelor and Jean Ross for more Bible answers live.

Doug: Welcome back listening friends. If you just tuned in, you're listening to Bible Answers Live and we have some phone lines still open. If you have a Bible question, we don't promise to have all the answers but we'll do our best to share what we know. The number is 800-GOD-SAYS. 800-463-7297 and my name is Doug Batchelor.

Jean: My name is Jean Ross and we’re going to -- Did we finish up that conversation with David?

Doug: Why don't we ask him, we’ll wrap that up.

Jean: David, are you still there?

David: Yes, I'm here. You started answering and went straight to a commercial.

Doug: Yes, we had a heart break, I wasn't watching the clock, I apologize. But you were asking about the question absent from the body, present with the Lord. I was saying that if a believer dies, their next conscious thought is the Lord descends from heaven, the dead in Christ rise and they are in the presence of the Lord. For somebody like King David who died 3,000 years ago, it says he went to sleep with his fathers and then you read in Acts chapter 2, David is dead and buried and not ascended to heaven.

David is still in the grave but for David, it’s going to seem like immediate. There's no consciousness of time, he will be in the presence of the Lord.

David: Yes sir, that's why I’ve listened to you guys for years and I try to go about it in a -- bring the scripture out and show them the way some people—I don’t want to say it’s their specific church or if it’s a doctrine of that church where they’re under the perception that it’s like where Jesus was on the cross. Whenever the person said, “Remember me when you're in your kingdom,” and He says, “I tell you today, you'll be with me in paradise.” Where some-

Doug: They Misunderstand.

David: -doctrines, they say, okay [unintelligible 00:32:30] there, but I’ve actually used what I’ve listened you before saying okay, Jesus didn’t go to heaven right that very day so that God could be waiting the same time.

Doug: What Christ is saying actually, you look in Luke and Jesus said, “Verily I say to you today,”-- and there's a comma, should become a there that says-- because there's no punctuation in the original Greek. The translators put the comma wherever they want. But he's saying, “I'm telling you today, you will be with me in paradise,” and making a statement today. I'm promising you today, you're going to be with me in paradise. He didn’t say you're going to be with me in paradise today, because it says in Jean Chapter 21, when Mary went to worship him, he said, “Do not detain me, I’ve not yet ascended to my father.”

That Sunday morning, he's still not there yet. When a person dies, they sleep a dreamless sleep, the next thing they know is the resurrection. The idea of our loved ones up in heaven looking down and spying on us or ghosts or anything like that, the dead in Christ arise when the Lord comes. Even Martha said to Jesus, “I know my brother Lazarus will rise in the last day.” New Testament is exceedingly clear. It sounds like you understand this David, but you or anyone else that wants to better understand what does the Bible say about death, we have a free offer for you on that subject.

Jean: We do, the book is -- actually it’s a study guide called Are the Dead Really Dead. We'll be happy to send this to anybody who calls and asks. The number is 800-835-6747, you can ask for the study guide called, Are the Dead Really Dead. If you have a Bible question, you can give us a call here to the studio, the number is 800-463-7298. Next call is Olga listening from New York. Olga, welcome to the program.

Olga: Hello.

Jean: Hi, you’re on the air.

Olga: I’m calling regarding a gentleman who called earlier about the Messiah being without sin.

Doug: Yes, you have another verse for us?

Olga: Yes, just a comment that Jean the Baptist said about Jesus that He is the Lamb of God. In the Old Testament, we see all the Jewish priests, they offer lamb without spot, a spotless lamb.

Doug: That’s a great example and I hope our friend is still listening and who is going to write that book. More of Old Testament evidence is the sacrificial lamb and the Messiah was a lamb, had to be without spot or blemish and a sign of this sinlesness, good example. I appreciate that and I hope – I trust he’s still listening and he can make a note of that. Thank you so much for your patience and calling to share that with us.

Olga: Okay, thank you.

Doug: God bless you.

Jean: Our next caller is Leon listening from Idaho. Leon, welcome to the program.

Leon: Thank you for taking my call Pastor Jean and Pastor Doug. I wanted to know who the king was when the scroll of the law was handed to him. He took a penknife and cut it in pieces, and threw it in the fire. I'm wondering if you know where that story is found.

Doug: That’s King Zedekiah. I'm looking it up for you right now. That's Jeremiah 36:23, “It came to pass and when Jehu died, he had read three or four leaves,” meaning three or four pages and it was off the leather parchment, “That he cut it with a penknife and cast in the fire that was on the hearth until all the roll was consumed in the fire that was on the hearth.” Jeremiah was told--

Leon: Jeremiah?

Doug: No. This is the scribe for King Zedekiah, his name was Jehudi, was reading it to the king that I think the king actually then took a penknife and threw the remainder of it in the fire.

Leon: And that’s found in Jeremiah 26: 33?

Doug: Jeremiah 36.

Leon: 36.

Doug: 23.

Leon: Okay, Is it found anywhere else in the Bible? Maybe in Samuel or?

Doug: No, sometimes you'll find a repeat between Kings and Chronicles, but this story in Jeremiah, I don't believe it appears in the Chronicles or in the books of Kings. It's only in Jeremiah. That's frightening when the king-- and you know what happened to Zedekiah. He would not listen, he was stubborn and finally, he was captured by the Babylonians. Jeremiah pleaded with him to surrender, he said, “It's not going to end well if you don't.” His sons were all killed before his eyes, his family taken captive and then they plucked his eyes out, and he went to battle, and he died there. That's what happened-

Leon: Disrespecting the law.

Doug: Yes, the Word of God was being read to him and he just cut it up and burned it, but all the prophecies still happened anyway.

Leon: Okay. Thank you very much Doug, I really appreciate it.

Doug: All righty, thank you, appreciate your calling Lean. Bye, bye.

Jean: And the phone number to call with your Bible question is 800-463-7297, it’s 800-463-7297. We have Barbara listening from Montana. Barbara, welcome to the program.

Barbara: Yes, I was afraid, you aren’t going to get to me before you run out of time.

Doug: We’ll try to get to you all if we can.

Barbara: I know everybody and has so many questions and I understand that I’m just in such a state of mind that I guess—I don’t even know how to decide. I lost my sister in June and then I didn’t know my husband was sick, and [unintelligible 00:48:01] 26th October, he died the 30th. I don’t even know how to put it. I love Jesus, He’s in my life. It isn’t very easy, it’s just that I’m still in the state of shock. My question that I called you about was, when I used to do the extensive Bible studies a few years ago, I was pretty sure there was scripture that said that you couldn't deny your own sister or brethren. That that was really a sin. Did I just imagine that?

Doug: I’ll tell you what I know about --first of all, our hearts go out to you, you suffered a lot of loss recently. I pray the Lord just gives you some encouragement through that. I know you feel-

Barbara: He will. God is with me, He’s never let me down.

Doug: Amen, but-

Barbara: I know He won’t now.

Doug: That’s right, He won’t. On the verse you're asking about, I think there's a passage that talks about if someone doesn't care for his own household, he’s worse than an infidel. Pastor Ross might find that verse for me. But Paul there is talking about when you're carrying financially taking care of the needs of your family, that you of course need to take care of your family first. There may be other passages that say that --now you're looking for something that's specifically says if you deny or don't respect your brother or sister, or? What's the wording that you remember?

Barbara: Just that you would be -- that it was unforgivable.

Doug: The only sin the kind of forgivable, is the unpardonable sin, which is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. If a person is unkind to their brother or sister, it doesn't mean it's unforgivable because Joseph’s brothers sold their brother and he forgave them and they'll be forgiven, right? There's cases in the Bible of siblings doing very unkind things and God will forgive that. But the wives of Jacob, Leah and Rachel, they had some real interesting fights. We won't go into on radio.

Jean: The verse you're referring to Pastor Doug, 1 Timothy chapter 5 that says,” But if anyone provide not for his own, especially for those in his own house, he has denied the faith and he's worse than an infidel.” It's particularly here in the church, there were people that weren’t providing for their family. Basically they were lazy individuals that were looking to the church to provide for their needs. Paul is saying, “Well, our first responsibility, especially as parents, is to take care of our children, to provide for the family and not to depend upon others handing stuff out to us.”

Doug: When, we're adult children we want to care for our aged parents-

Jean: Absolutely-

Doug: I don't know if that's the verse you're looking for but I hope that will help a little bit, Barbara.

Barbara: I guess all I can do is see the one the sister that died was one that refused to have anything to do with me. When I would ask her, “What did I do? What did I ever do to you?” She would just say that, “Never mind. I love you.” Then when she died, she lived in Portland and I live in Montana, her son called me the night before she died, he said, ”Aunt Barb, my mom is dying, she's not going to make it through the night. I'm calling you to let you know but she does not want you to come.”

Doug: That hurts, doesn't it?-

Barbara: -[unintelligible 00:01:44] it’s more than hurt. It’s like a knife. I said, “Okay, Ryan, I really appreciate you letting me know.” Then he said she's been sick for a year but the cancer went into her brain, and on and on. He was very sweet about it all. They had been a memorial service at my home town, and I did go to that, and I didn’t get kicked out [unintelligible 00:02:03].

Doug: No, well, everybody listening right now out there, Barb, can relate with you because we've all had some probably interesting relationships with family and extended family. I know that in my family, my mom and her mom didn't talk for nine years, they finally reconciled. But you can only ask someone to forgive you, if they don't forgive you or they don't want to have a relationship, you can't do anything else about it. You just do your best to try and get along, and be a consistent Christian, and humble yourself. If people will accept that, great, if they don't, don't let their problem be your problem.

Don’t let your sister's rejection, whatever it might be, whatever her problem might have been, don't let that be your problem. You just forgive her and say, it's not in the Bible but people often say ‘what is, is,’ meaning there's some things you can't change, and you don't want to be haunted by it that. I pray the Lord gives you comfort through those things, Barbara, and just press on, God has a work for you to do. You will enjoy the book that we're offering tonight dealing with the subject of the trials; Deathwatch in Siberia. It’s got a great testimony in it.

Jean: The number to call for that is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the book, it's free, we’ll be happy to send it to you, called Deathwatch in Siberia. If you have a Bible question, the phone line here to the studio is 800-463-7297. not too late to give us a call and try get your question answered this evening. Our next call is Alisha listening in Huntsville, Alabama. Alisha, welcome to the program.

Alisha: Thank you. I have a question, I need some clarity about speaking in tongues, as it refers to in 1 Corinthians 14, there are several texts that seem to contradict each other-

Doug: Which one?-

Alisha: -verse 13 and 14, verse 22.

Doug: Let’s start with verse 13 and 14, “Wherefore, let him that speaks in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret, for if I pray in unknown tongue, my spirit prays but my understanding is unfruitful.” That is a difficult verse the way it's translated in King James because what Paul is saying is if someone is speaking in a tongue, a tongue there just means a language, a language. They’re in the Corinthian church, they're in a service, they’re from many different languages because Corinth was a seaport on the Mediterranean, the Romans had slaves there from all over the Empire. Many different languages were there.

They’d get up in the services and start praying, and preaching and talking in a language no one else understood. It said, “Pray that he might interpret,” in other words, “Pray there might be and a translator to explain what they're saying.” Then Paul says, “For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prays,” I might pray in my spirit if I'm praying in a language the people there don't understand, but my understanding is unfruitful to the people listening.

All he’s saying is, for instance, if I should start to preach or pray in Hebrew and say [Hebrew language], I could be praying a spirit felt prayer but what I understand in my prayer is not fruitful to anybody listening unless there’s a translator. Does that make sense?

Alisha: Yes, that makes sense.

Doug: People have often misunderstood that.

Jean: We have a book that you'll really enjoy, it’s called Understanding Tongues, and it deals with these very verses that we’re talking about right now.

Doug: Free.

Jean: We’ll be happy to send this to you Alisha, all you’ll have to do is just call us on our resource phone number and that number to call is 800-835-6747. I'm going to say it again, 800-835-6747. Ask for the book called Understanding Tongues and we’ll be happy to send it to you. There’s a lot of references there, a lot of scriptural passages, I think you'll find it very helpful. Thank you again for your call, our next call is Carol listening from Connecticut. Carol, welcome to the program.

Carol: Hello.

Doug: Hi Carol, thanks for calling, and your question tonight.

Carol: Yes, my question tonight is I'm a little confused about three things. I took my mother in and I have taken care of for almost a year and a half now. There’s this verse on your mother and father. The job has become draining to me because of several situations that I'm going through. There’s siblings in the family that dictate, dictate, judge me and everything about the job that I'm doing. There is constant fighting and there’s homeless brother also that I’ve taken in.

My question is since I took my mother, I have gotten very angered and bitter toward the siblings that don't understand the tiredness and drainness that this job takes because you give your life to another one. I haven't been able to go to church. Because I haven't been able to go to church because I can't bring her, I don't get that spiritual from my sister and brothers, and my pastor of anymore where I could talk them to come back to realization what God really wants me to do.

I'm really calling you up because I'm broken in many parts of my body now trying to do the right thing, at the same time, really starting to dislike the family that I've had because they -- that's where the woman just said, “Your worth an infidel if you don't help your family.” What does God say when you're just totally drained, my husband is tired of living like this. What does God want me to honestly do because since I've had her, there’s separation from the families with the sisters, and at the same time, I want to take care of her but I'm drained out.

Doug: Let me give you a couple of thoughts, and it’s sounds like this isn't as much a Bible question as it counseling question. Because the Bible says, “Honor your parents,” but at the same time, you need to take care of yourself, it would be nice if you could have a family meeting. I don't know with your relationship with your siblings, but it’d be great if you would just say -- It might have to happen through a letter where you say, “It would be great if you guys could take mom these days or you could contribute to help me get some outside help to help on a certain day, so I can get some rest, take care of my health.”

Just look for a meeting because you're right, if there's an incredible strain and you can't ever go to church, you got to have someone in the family, and if no one will help in the family, you got to try and get some outside help to come in and just spell you. To give you a break so that you can also take care of your own needs, your own life, and your own family and still someone neds to take care of mom. You don't want to say, “Well, this is a strain and so, I'm putting Mom on the street.” I’m just going to pray God gives you wisdom, Carol, because that is a trial. She might also be encouraged by the book we're offering tonight.

Jean: Yes, the book deals with the testimony of somebody who faced some real trials and how God provided strength. The book is called Deathwatch in Siberia. The number to call is 800-835-6747, you can ask for that, it's called Deathwatch in Siberia. We’ll be happy to send it to anyone who calls and asks. Our next call is Carolyn listening from New Jersey. Carolyn, welcome to Bible Answers Live.

Carolyn: Good evening, I’m reading the Song of Bernadette and it talks about the Immaculate Conception. It states that Mary was born sinless. How do I as a believer deal with the Immaculate Conception because I know that Mary was not born sinless?

Doug: Well, there’s a couple of different things. First of all, Mary in her prayer when she hears she’s going to have this baby. I don't know if it's in her prayer or in Luke’s prayer where she talks about Jesus as her savior. If God is her savior, if she needs a savior, she must be a sinner because if you're sinless, you don't need a savior. The idea that Mary was sinless is totally foreign to everything else.

The Bible says, “All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God,” and the only time in the Bible, and that's of course in Romans. The only time the Bible there's any exception to all of us sinning and fallen short of the glory of God is where it says, “Christ did no sin.” And so, the only one who did no sin is Jesus, otherwise, all of us have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.

Jean: Luke 1:47 is the one you’re referring to that.

Doug: Mary declares, God is my--

Jean: She says, “My spirit is rejoiced in God my savior.”

Doug: Everyone else needed salvation from sin. There’s nothing in the Bible, zero, nada that says that Mary was sinless. The reason the Catholic’s developed that Doctrine is because they figured that how could a sinful body give birth to a sinless savior? She would have to be sinless. Then the argument just goes back one more generation. How could Mary's mother be sinless and give birth to a sinful daughter? You keep having that problem. I don’t know why they’re trying to solve it.

You can see a beautiful white lily come out of a brown swamp and God can do it. He can make the Son of God a baby inside a mother, has a whole different blood type than the mother. Not always but in many occasions, a whole different blood type. Something happens between the placenta and the uterus, and the baby in that embryonic fluid. It's just a whole unique creature and Jesus was sinless. It’s not just the biology of sin. Sin is it’s not in the physical, in our DNA. Sin is a choice to do evil and guilt from sinning. Jesus was sinless because he never sinned. Babies aren’t born with a sinful record.

Carolyn: Then there really is nothing to the conception that is false?

Doug: Excuse me?

Carolyn: As a believer, we would know that the Immaculate Conception is a false concept?

Doug: Yes. Sometimes we people get confused. I remember as a baby Christian. I thought Immaculate Conception was talking about the sinlessness of Jesus conception and then later on I’ve known, it's talking about Mary, and I was shocked by that. Because we all know Mary was a virgin. Jesus was born in that way, in a miraculous way.

Carolyn: Right, that's how I believe the Immaculate Conception. I believe that it's Jesus being born immaculately through the Holy Spirit.

Doug: The Catholics are referring to Mary, though. It’s nothing. It’s zero in the Bible that says anything about Mary being sinless. We do have a website that talks about this subject where it's called Mary Truth and we invite you to go there, if you take a look, Carolyn, to Mary truth and you’ll find more information there.

Jean: This call is from Rose listening from Detroit, Michigan. Rose, welcome to the program.

Rose: Hi, thank you. I thought that I was going to ask you about the Sabbath because back in the day or in the Bible it says that He was three nights in the Tomb and then He Rose on the third day, and that would be Wednesday night, Thursday night, Friday night because the Sabbath was sunset Friday, the sunset Saturday. But that aside, just let me quickly.

I want to complement the woman who's taking care of her mom and let her know that Americans, especially baby boomers, are going to have to shift their paradigm and realize that all those years your parents were taking care of you. You didn't get to know them and this is your last chance to know them. This is God's way of helping you to order your steps by the care that you give your parent. If you listen to them, they will tell you things you don't know by their ancestors--

Doug: There's always going to be a blessing in taking care of the senior citizens in your family. We’re always richer when we -- sometimes we’ll take our kids and family to a nursing home. Now, let me see something about the three days, Rose. I appreciate your other comment as well, that encouragement. But the idea that Jesus, where it says three nights, that's only found one time in the Bible in Matthew chapter 12 at somewhere around 38, I think, Pastor Ross. Where he's talking about the sign of Jonah.

Jesus is not referring to being in the tomb 3 days and 3 nights. He's talking about the sufferings, the time he would be suffering for the sin of the world. Heart of the earth is not talking about the tomb. It’s talking about he went in the clutches of the world 3 days and 3 nights and that started Thursday night when he was betrayed. Thursday night, Friday night, Saturday night, Christ was in the heart of the earth suffering for the sins of the world. It's not the tomb as many assume.

Jesus was betrayed Thursday night and He rose Sunday morning. It says it was the first day of the week and He died on Friday just before the Sabbath. Hopefully, that will help. We do have a book called The Sign of Jonah and that we’ll send you a free copy of that if you just call and ask us.

Jean: The number to call is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the book called The Sign of Jonah. Again, that number is 800-835-6747 and ask for the book The Sign of Jonah. You can actually go to the Amazing Facts website and you can read the book for free online. Again, The Sign of Jonah.

Doug: Pastor Ross, for telling the same thing, we got 1 or 2 minutes here, half a minute. That’s not fair to anybody. Friends, if we did not get to your question tonight. We hope you'll give us another chance. Please forgive us and we just have a couple of people standing by. Keep in mind that this program, if you are enjoying it and you’re listening, it's only here because some people just like you who are listening say, “You know, I want to keep it on the air.”

You can send a donation to support Bible Answers Live by just going to the Amazing Facts website. It's God bless, we will look forward to studying His word together with you again next time.

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