The Devil's Counterfeits (2018)

Date: 03/17/2019 
God desires to help us in every way, in every problem, in every detail, every day. As you tune in to this episode of Bible Answers Live, you'll realize that He is a personal God, there to ease you in your anger, to guide you to the truth, to reveal to you the keys to salvation and to help you understand what you are worth to Him... so precious you are to Him that He gave His Son for you. Listen and study along with Pastor Doug and Pastor Ross, in this episode of Bible Answers Live.
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Pastor Doug: Welcome listening friends. Would you like to hear an amazing fact? Normally, when you think of flowers, we picture something small, delicate, and fragrant. Those are probably not the words you would use to describe a flower found growing in the rain forests of Sumatra. It's known as the Titan Arum. This giant flower can take between seven to 10 years to produce its first bloom. When it does bloom, you'll know it. The flower looks like an eight-foot-long loaf of French bread protruding straight up from a deep burgundy and green pleated skirt that surrounds the base. One record-breaking specimen in a Botanical Garden in New Hampshire had a central spike more than 10 feet high and leaves 13 feet around. This plant is heavy too, with some specimens weighing in at over £300. The Titan Arum is also known as the corpse flower because when it does bloom, it emits a sickening smell. Some have described the odor as a cross between dirty socks, garlic, limburger cheese, and a rotten fish. I bet you're glad you're being protected by radio right now.

The plant puts off a rotten smell for about 48 hours to attract flies and beetles that help pollinate it. The Corpse Flower is also one of the only plants that can generate its own heat through a chemical reaction between 98 degrees when in full bloom. It's hard to imagine such a large majestic flower that stinks. The Bible says Satan's counterfeits often work the same way. Stay with us friends. We're going to learn more on this edition of Bible Answers Live.


Speaker 1: You're listening to a Bible answers live. Honest answers to your Bible questions. This broadcast is a previously recorded episode. To receive any of the Bible resources mentioned in this evening's program, call 800 835 6747. Once again, that's 800 835 6747. Now let's join our host Pastor Doug Batchelor and our co-host Pastor John Ross.

Pastor Doug: Welcome listening friends to Bible Answers Live and we're here to do our best to answer your Bible questions. If you have a question, lines are wide open now. Good time to pick up your phone, give us a call. That number is 800-GOD-SAYS call in with your Bible questions. It's a free phone call of course in North America (800) 463 7297. As the title suggests, this is an international Bible study. We invite you to call in, talk about the word of God, the most important book. My name is Doug Batchelor.

Pastor John: My name is John Ross. Good evening, friends. Pass the duck as usual. Let's start the program with prayer. Dear Father in heaven, we thank you for the opportunity once again, to open up your word and study together. We want to ask your blessing upon this program. People those who are listening, Lord, guide us into a clear understanding of the Bible. For we ask this in Jesus name, amen.

Pastor Doug: Amen.

 Pastor John: I'll pass it to you open the program but talking about a remarkable flower that first of all, it's big. I was looking at a picture of it online earlier actually. There was one occasion when I was in DC, and this particular plant was flowering there at one of the museums and people formed a long line to go in and look at it. It wasn't smelling by the time we made it in but it's quite impressive. It is a big flower. Yet the strange thing about it is it's got this terrible smell that is irresistible to certain bugs and flies.

Pastor Doug: Yes. It's the opposite of the kind of flower that would attract a butterfly looking for a fragrance. This one it's supposed to imitate the stench of carrion and that's also they suspect that it's made where it also puts off heat like something decomposing and so it's hot, it's red in the middle and it stinks and flies just love it. Of course, they come disappointed they don't find anything. They're deceived into coming, but in the process, they are used by the flower to pollinate. It's deceptive because when you look at the flower from the distance, it's got a big yellow stalk coming out of that red skirt and it's majestic looking. You get close and you take a whiff.-- I actually saw YouTube a show people's faces. It may have been the one there at the Botanical Gardens in Washington DC, showed all these people lined up coming to see the flower and they get close and they just turn up their noses but it only makes that terrible smell for a little while. Anyway, it's here you get a flower. It's masquerading as a flower, but it really stinks.

In the Bible, Jesus warns that the devil will sometimes look like a sheep, but He's really a wolf. Many of the deceptions that the devil has in the Bible, he counterfeits something good and he replaces it with something dangerous or deadly or deceptive. That's his practice. The devil's got a counterfeit for love. He's got a counterfeit for the gift of tongues. The devil has a counterfeit baptism, so you can name just about any doctrine. He's taken all these various truths and he's got a counterfeit. It'll look good from a distance but on closer investigation, it doesn't smell right. Doesn't pass the smell test, as they say. Maybe you'd like to understand better and what some of these counterfeits are and how you can spot them, friends. We have a free offer tonight for you on that subject.

 Pastor John: We have a book that's entitled Satan's Confusing Counterfeits. This is a free offer for anyone who will call in and ask. The phone line to call for this free offer (800) 835 6747, and you can ask for the book called Satan's Confusing Counterfeits. That number again is (800)-835-6747 and ask for the book, Satan's Confusing Counterfeits. In fact, if you didn't know, we're also streaming live this evening on Facebook on the Amazing Facts Facebook page, and I think Pastor Doug on your page as well.

Pastor Doug: Yes. The Doug Batchelor Facebook page.

 Pastor John: We'd like to meet those who are joining us on Facebook. If you have a Bible question, you might want to give us a call here. The number to call is (800) 463 7297. That'll bring your call right in here to the studio. First call that we have this evening is Stephanie listening in New Mexico. Stephanie welcome to the program.

Stephanie: Hi. Thank you.

 Pastor John: Thank you. Your question tonight?

Stephanie: Okay. My question comes out of James 3: six and eight, where it talks about the tongue is a fire of iniquity. How it defiles the whole body, and then eight where it says, "No man contain the tongue. It's unruly evil full of deadly poison." I struggle with some anger, bitterness, wrath that I'm working on and my tongue is not tamed at all. I pray all the time, and we came across this scripture at church today. What is the answer to taming the tongue?

Pastor Doug: Matthew 12, Jesus said, "Out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks." As you mentioned, if you're struggling with anger, it's going to be hard to repress that and not to voice the anger, the bitterness or whatever you're going through. It requires really a transformation of the heart. When we're born again, no man contain the tongue, but the Lord can change our hearts and that ends up changing our words.

It is very important for us to pray that God will help us get victory over our words, because, in Matthew 12, Jesus also said that, "In the judgment we'll give an account for every idle word that we speak for by your words, you'll be condemned and by your words, you'll be justified." Now, of course, all of us have said things we shouldn't say. All of us need to ask that God will forgive us for reckless speaking. When we get a new heart, we then pray the Lord will help us to say those things that are positive, good, pure, kind, and it may not happen overnight, but as our hearts are transformed, our words change. Just a very quick and simplistic illustration.

Before I was a Christian, I had a very foul mouth. [chuckles] The druggies I was hanging out with back in those days, we just used all the curse words and I probably still know them all. Once the Lord got ahold in my heart, I began to feel Jesus wouldn't talk like that, and I want to follow Jesus. Little by little I'd catch myself. The Holy Spirit would just stop me when I was about to say one of those words or I'd say it then I feel so bad I wouldn't do it anymore. I don't have that problem anymore. The Lord changed my heart, He changed my tongue. That's not that there isn't still room for growth but I've just witnessed firsthand when God changes your heart, it can change your words.

Stephanie: Okay. That's awesome. Do you have a resource on anger or taming the tongue, anything like that?

Pastor Doug: We do.

Stephanie: Roots of bitterness, anything like that?

 Pastor John: Yes. We have a little book that I think you'll find very interesting called Tips for Resisting Temptation and deals with those principles of a change of heart, how to control one's temper or attitude, it'll be in there, it'll address that and we'll be happy to send that to you for free. Again, the book is called Tips for Resisting Temptation. The number for our resources 800 835 6747.

Pastor Doug: There's another book, you can also

 read for free online, Stephanie, and it's specifically on the subject of speaking and it's called Tiny Troublemaker.

Pastor John: That's a good one.

Pastor Doug: It talks about if you wrestle with gossip, but it'll have some of the same verses that we talked about. You can read that for free at the Amazing Facts. Well, both books are free. You can read that one right now for free at the Amazing Facts website. You just type in Tiny Troublemaker, and you type in Joe Cruise it'll probably pull it up right away. Thank you. I appreciate your call.

Pastor John: Next call that we have is Jerry, listening in Oregon. Jerry, welcome to the program.

Jerry: Thank you, Pastors Ross and Bachelor. About a year ago, I asked a question about a white lie or a justified lie, and Pastor Doug said a lie is a lie basically, categorically. I realized that in Revelation it says all liars are excluded from the Holy City. I was just rereading Exodus I and it gave an account where Pharaoh ordered two midwives to kill all the baby boys. They didn't do it. Then, Pharaoh asked them why they didn't do it, and they responded, "Because Hebrew women are more vigorous, and they give birth before we can get there," which was a lie basically. Then, in Chapter 20, Verse 20 of Chapter I, it says, "So God was kind to the midwives and the people increased and became even more numerous." Now, that, technically, was a lie, but obviously, was a justified lie.

Pastor Doug: Why would God bless them, because it seems like the Lord would be bending his own rules?

Jerry: Well, to an extent. Obviously, one is not supposed to kill children either, but, again, they were put into a difficult position and they offered a justified lie.

Pastor Doug: My guess is, it's interesting you would ask this because I read that verse this week.

Jerry: I do the same thing Pastor Doug. I hear things and I just studied them a couple days before. It's happened so many times, but that's a digression. I'm sorry. Go ahead.

Pastor Doug: That's okay. It's amazing how the Lord does that. I thought about that this week. In the answer, the ladies gave, because here they are the midwives for this nation of Israel. You read in Exodus, it says, "God blessed them and they increased greatly," I think two or three times as they multiplied very greatly, so much so the Egyptians were saying, "What are we going to do? These guys are just becoming so numerous." Those midwives, two midwives, and it names them-- It's very unusual that it actually gives their names. It says, "God bless them." There probably were times when they got there and the baby was already born. I think maybe they were citing a couple of cases where it was true that they got there before they were-- the babies were already born by the time they got there. I'm sure that was a partial truth. I would agree with you that they also had just decided, "We are not going to kill these babies." The Lord winks at our ignorance sometimes. It's like he blessed Rahab when she lied and said, "All the messengers went out the gate, you better run after them." What she did was a bold-faced lie. She was a Pagan, she was doing the best she could, and with those midwives, the Israelites in Egypt, they were not obeying all of God's commandments. I think he winked at their ignorance. It doesn't mean that God blesses lying. It just means that he meets people where they're at. They were frightened and they didn't want to die. They didn't want to hurt neither babies, and so God blessed them. God always wants us to tell the truth.

Jerry: On a similar note, supposing I approached you and I say, "Pastor Doug, I'd like to show you a picture of my granddaughter. She's a beautiful child. I swear someday she's going to be Miss America." I show you the picture and you think, "Well, this little girl is going to have to go through quite a metamorphosis." You're probably going to say, "Yes, she's a beautiful girl." [laughs] That's really not a terrible thing.

Pastor Doug: That's an unfair question. Can we go to the next caller, please.


That is something that when you're a pastor and you're at the door, frequently people come out and they'll say, "Here's our new baby." You look at some of the babies, they're just adorable. They're all adorable to the mothers. Some are better looking than others, I think we'll all admit but, boy, you're in trouble if you say anything other than that's a beautiful baby. [laughs] You got us there, that I think sometimes just out of graciousness, we speak with a little bit of hyperbole and we tell everybody, "Your kids are adorable," and so forth.

That's just considered good manners. You're right. You're probably not going to get very far in life if you tell everybody everything you think about them. You know what I mean?

Jerry: The two examples I cited, there was no malicious intent.

Pastor Doug: That's right. I still think a Christian should always be honest. I think you need to be kind. There are times when you don't say everything you're thinking. Even Christ said to the disciples, "There's many things I have to say to you, but you cannot bear them now." In other words, he said,"You just don't tell a five-year-old everything about the birds and the bees because they just can't handle it at that age." Not saying everything, there's biblical reasons for that, because timing is important, but I don't think we should ever be dishonest or misleading. We should be transparent. Just pray for diplomacy if you see an ugly baby. I thank you very much for your question. That was a good question.

Pastor Ross: Our next caller is Gina, listening in Ohio. Gina, welcome to the program.

Gina: Hi, how are you?

Pastor Doug: Good. Thanks for calling.

Gina: You're welcome. It's good to talk to you. I have a question about the Sabbath. I've always felt really guilty about, because you always have your utilities on, your gas or electric, there's no way to shut them off. I will feel really bad because I'm making somebody work at these companies. Is there anything, biblically, that tells us not to work or make anybody else work? Like I said, I feel guilty about--

Pastor Doug: Well, that is a good practical question. I think all of us would agree that we're thankful that on the Sabbath day our phones are working with power grids still on in the house. We know there's people out there that are operating those services. Jesus, one time someone said, "Lord, I want to follow you, but first I've got to bury my father." Jesus said something a little disturbing. He said, "Let the dead bury the dead. You follow me." We can't control what everybody does. There are going to be people that will be doing that, that don't know the Lord, and don't let them do it, but we shouldn't be doing it. I don't know if that makes sense. [crosstalk] Help me Pastor Ross.

Gina: [crosstalk] the electric is on and the gas is on.

Pastor Ross: I think, first of all, let's just say you turn off all the power or you disconnect the gas for 24 hours, will that have any impact upon the people that are actually working in the utilities getting power and gas to hundreds of homes throughout the city? This is not going to make any difference to them.

Pastor Doug: They're still going to be doing their job.

Pastor Ross: It's a little different if you are hiring someone specifically to come and hook up your power on the Sabbath. That's a little different. Here's someone that's doing the job, they're going to be doing it whether you use the power or you don't use the power. It's out of your control. It's out of your-- You don't have direction in-

Pastor Doug: Seventh commandment says-

Pastor Ross: Within your house.

Pastor Doug: Within your gates. We're really only able to control what happens within our gates. If you own the power company, that might be different. We want to talk to you about something else if you own the power company.

Stephanie: Well, it's true. Well, thank you very much. I appreciate that.

Pastor Doug: Thank you. I appreciate your question.

Pastor Ross: Next caller that we have is Michael, listening in Michigan. Michael, welcome to the program.

Michael: Hey, guys, can you hear me?

Pastor Doug: Loud and clear.


Michael: Awesome. I figured. I just want to make sure to speak to these headphones that I have. The question I have about other denominations. Does the Bible specifically say that all, meaning, Catholic or whatever, every denomination will be in heaven? Where are the Bible texts for that, because I have a lot of people saying that [unintelligible 00:18:33] are not the only ones going to heaven? I've had countless people saying that to me. Well, I don't know where the Bible verses are. I heard that every denomination will be in heaven. I'm like, "Well, okay."

Pastor Doug: Let me just back up to restate the question a little bit. If you've got your radio on in the background, you may want to turn that down because we're getting feedback from that. I don't think, I hope there aren't people out there that think only one denomination is going to be in heaven. Jesus is pretty clear that there are people who were born Jewish, that aren't going to be saved just because they're Jewish. He said, "Those who don't follow the truth, they're children of the devil." Doesn't matter what denomination you're in. And there are people in the church that aren't going to be in heaven. The Lord said, "Other sheep I have that are not of this fold, them also I must call and there will be one fold and one shepherd." I think that's John Chapter 10.

There's good people. If they're living up to the scriptural truth that they have, God doesn't judge us by what we don't know. Another way I might say that, there'll be people in heaven like King David and Solomon that had scores of wives. Well, we know that's wrong. It's not true that you should have that many wives. There'll be people in heaven that maybe

 they didn't understand what the Bible says about clean and unclean food. Well, they didn't know. God winks at their ignorance. The Bible says, "Now He commands everyone to repent." When you know the truth, Hebrews chapter 10 says, "Sin is knowing to do good and not doing it." God is not looking on denominational roles to see who is saved, he's looking at are we living up to the light that he's given us? We've got a book that I think helps answer that, it's called "Search for the True Church". We're about to send that to anybody who calls and asks one of the biblical characteristics that are given for God's people nowadays, I will be happy to send that to you. The number to call is 800-835-6747.

You can ask for the book called "The Search for the True Church". That's all that we have. Let's see, we've got Vernon listening in New York. Vernon, welcome to the program.

Vernon: Hey, how are you guys doing?

Pastor Doug: Good. Thanks for calling.

Vernon: Thank you. I've asked this question before and never got a good, solid answer for this question so I will present this to both of you. When it comes to God, He's omniscient. He has ability of omnipresent and He's omnipotent. Am I correct on those three things?

Pastor Doug: Yes.

Vernon: Okay. Sin first started in heaven, and not on Earth. Am I correct in that?

Pastor Doug: Yes.

Vernon: Okay. Now let's go down to the earth. When God had created Adam and Eve, He put forth a tree in the garden called the Tree of Good and Evil. This is my question, then I'd love to hear your answer. Since God has these three attributes, if that tree wasn't there, there would be no sin on Earth nor would Christ had to come to down the cross and people on the earth would live forever because we know Satan came down and tempted Eve, and Eve brought forth the fruit to her husband, and God had to bring judgment upon all three, for the sin that was committed. Here's my question, why did God put that tree there? Should not that tree have not been there? Have a nice day.

Pastor Doug: All right. Thank you very much for your question. Well, when the tree was placed in the garden, the tree was actually there to limit the ways that Satan could access this new world. God told Adam and Eve, He said, "Look, there's been a rebellion in the universe, and one of the highest of our creations has chosen a way of selfishness and sin and he is going through the universe, he's got limited access to recruit people to his side, do not go to this tree. This is a forbidden tree." Adam and Eve were warned that that tree might be the gateway to evil coming into their lives. In order for God to give all of his creatures freedom, he had to give them the opportunity to make a decision.

Really, if the tree wasn't here, one of them kept the devil from coming into our world and tempting Adam and Eve, it would have been on some other ground. But God just restricted, he said, "look, I'm going to give you one restriction and it's just this tree. It's the only place where Satan is going to be able to access this world to tempt". God made all of his creatures free and in order to really be free and to choose to love Him, we have to have the opportunity to make a choice. He gave them that opportunity. You would really enjoy a DVD that we produced that goes into more detail talking about where did sin come from and what if God had done things differently, what would have happened. It's called, "Cosmic Conflict". I think you can just YouTube "Cosmic Conflict" or go to the Amazing Facts YouTube channel, and you can watch the whole thing for free right there online.

Pastor John: Our next caller that we have is Dennis listening in Vacaville. Dennis, welcome to the program.

Dennis: Thank you very much and thank you for being there to help all of us.

Pastor Doug: Well, it's a blessing. We got about four minutes or three minutes before the break, Dennis, let's get right to your question.

Dennis: As God has the foresight, and prophesied and foretold of end time signs, I was wondering, are there any verses that nearly describe some of these modern things that we do? People flying in the air, in airplanes like birds, or flying around the earth or traveling to the moon, or such a thing as nuclear bombs wiping out whole cities?

Pastor Doug: Well, let me give you a couple of verses that have been pointed to. Daniel chapter 12, Daniel says many will run to and fro and knowledge will increase. That's a pretty broad statement but he's talking about people going to and fro. They already went to and fro in his day, but they did it on horseback. Now they're going to and fro, people travel hundreds of miles, thousands of miles from the place of their birth, they didn't use to do that. People often never went more than 50 miles from their birthplace in their entire life. That was one thing and he says knowledge will increase.

He didn't say wisdom would increase because people aren't really much wiser today than they used to be but knowledge and technology has increased greatly. Jesus said, except those days be shortened no flesh would be saved, implying that man would have the ability to destroy himself. I forget Pastor Ross in Revelation is it chapter 11, where it says God will destroy those who destroy the Earth?

Pastor John: Yes, Revelation 11.

Pastor Doug: Man did not have the ability to destroy the earth when John wrote the book of revelation but man certainly has the technology and the ability through chemicals, pollution, nuclear weapons to destroy the earth now. That's just a handful but it sounds to me brother like you'd really enjoy our study guide, talking about the Second Coming. It goes into some of the science of the Second Coming as well and that's called "The Ultimate Deliverance".

Pastor John: "The Ultimate Deliverance", we'll be happy to send that to anybody who calls and asks. The number is 800-835-6747. You can ask of the study guide called, "The Ultimate Deliverance" all about the Second Coming. It talks about signs that relate to the Second Coming.

Pastor Doug: Absolutely. Now, we're going to be taking a break in just a moment. Pastor Ross and I were going to tell you before we go to the break, that if you've not seen it before, for the students out there that enjoy Bible study, there is a website called, and it has a Bible timeline. I think it's one of the more popular Bible timelines you'll find on the internet. You can look at the scope all the way from creation, you can see where the major events occurred, and track all the way from creation down through up to the Second Coming. We don't set a date for that, which shows that it's next on the calendar. Just check out

Again, we want to tell you we have lines open if you give us a call 800-463-7297. I want to greet again our friends that are watching on Facebook, you can join them if you are curious what it looks like here in the studio, at simply Amazing Facts Facebook page, we're going to be back in just a few moments.

Speaker 1: Stay tuned. Bible answers live will return in a moment.

Ad: Journey back through time, to the center of the universe. Discover how a perfect Angel transformed into Satan the arch-villain. The birth of evil, of rebellion in heaven. A movie that moved to earth. The whole, the creation of a beautiful new planet, and the first humans. Witness the temptation. Discover God's amazing plan to save his children. This is a story that involves every life on earth. Every life. The "Cosmic Conflict", if God is good, if God is all-powerful if God is love, then what went wrong? Did you know that Noah was present at the birth of Abraham? Okay, maybe he wasn't in the room but he was alive and probably telling stories about his floating zoo.

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Speaker 1: Every Bible question you have answered moves you one step closer to the fullness of God's will for your life. What are you waiting for? Get the answers you need for a fuller, richer, more confident life. You're listening to Bible Answers Live. This broadcast has a previously recorded episode. If you'd like answers to your Bible-related questions on the air, please call us next Sunday between 7:00 PM and 8:00 PM Pacific time. To receive any of the Bible resources mentioned in this evening's program, call 800-835-6747. Once again that's 800-835-6747. Now let's join pastors Doug Batchelor and John Ross for more Bible Answers Live.

Pastor Doug: Welcome back listening friends. This is Bible Answers Live if you tuned in along the way. We're glad you joined us. It's a live international interactive Bible study and you can call in with your questions free phone call 800-463-7297. We're also broadcasting this on Facebook at the Amazing Facts Facebook page and Doug Batchelor's Facebook page. I am Doug Batchelor.

Pastor John: My name is John Ross, and we're going to go to the phone lines. We've got a caller who has a question about Daniel 9. We're going to see if we can get a hold of him. The question relates to Daniel 9. Are you listening?

Caller 1: Yes. Can you hear me?

Pastor John: Yes. You're on the air.

Caller 1: Okay. Sweet. Daniel 9:25, where it's says, "Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be so many weeks". My understanding is that this prophecy started in Ezra 7 with the decree of Artaxerxes. My question was why did it not start in Ezra 1? You said it was with the decree of Cyrus where Cyrus is telling Ezra to basically go and build the temple.

Pastor John: There were actually three decrees; the first decree that was given to allow the Jews to go back and start rebuilding the Temple. Their work was stopped and so the same decree was given again to just allow them through Darius to continue finishing the temple. It was the third decree by Xerxes in 457 BC which allowed them to rebuild Jerusalem and that involved building a wall around the city. If you look at verse 25, "Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem". That was really the third decree that allowed them to actually rebuild the city and the wall.

Pastor Doug: The last part of the verse says, "And the street, and the wall will be built again in troublous times". It specifies the wall.

Caller 1: Hey, look at that. Okay.

Pastor John: Of course, the whole book of Nehemiah is about rebuilding the wall.

Caller 1: Awesome. Thank you.

Pastor John: All right. Hey, good question. Now we've got a whole study on Daniel line that is outstanding. Would that be right on time?

Pastor Doug: Yes.

Pastor John: Or is that what God sends today for the judgment. We've got two lessons there.

Pastor Doug: I think both are good. They both touch on Daniel 9, but let me give you both. You can just call and ask for them. We'll be happy to send it to you. The one study guide deals with Right on Time which deals with Daniel 9, and the other one is God Set a Date for the Judgment. We'll be happy to send those two studies to anybody who asks. The number is 800-835-6747. You can ask for a study guide dealing with Daniel 9. It's God Set a Date for the Judgment and Right on Time are the names of the two lessons. Our next caller that we have is Doug listening in Minnesota. Doug, welcome to the program.

Douglas: I have a question about how God is going to deal with the wicked after the after thousand-year period.

Pastor Doug: Yes. Well, if you read in Revelation 20 that it tells us about the wicked they surround the beloved city as if they're going to attack it. By the way what you find in Revelation 20 about Gog and Magog also is found is-- at Ezekiel 37 Pastor Ross?

Pastor John: I think Ezekiel 37 and 38 talk about Gog and Magog, but it depicts some of the same scenes where these enemies of Gog surround the city of Gog and there's a great white throne judgment and ultimately fire comes down from God out of heave and forms a great lake of fire and all the wicked are punished according to what they deserve. I think the parallel passage in the Old Testament, Ezekiel 38 talks about Gog and Magog and the destruction that comes.

Pastor Doug: Yes. That's the conclusion of the 1,000 years. It says the rest of the dead do not live until the thousand years are finished. Well, if the dead in Christ rise first, the rest of the dead are the wicked. You get the dead in Christ that's the righteous, the rest of the dead is everybody who isn't saved, that's the lost. They come forth at the end of the 1,000 years, and when they realize they're permanently doomed, Satan tries to rally them to a final assault on the City of God and that's when Judgment happens and punishment. We have a study guide we can send you on that for free. It's called--

Douglas: Can I say--

Pastor Doug: I'm sorry. Go ahead.

Douglas: Can I say something?

Pastor Doug: Yes.

Douglas: We're told that some will die will live on for a number of days. It sounds like they don't die instantly, the wicked.

Pastor Doug: Yes. It does talk about-- it says they're speaking more particularly about the devil. It talked about day and night. How long individuals will suffer varies because the Bible tells us that each man is rewarded according to his work, but we're in that group of Protestants we do believe in hell and the lake of fire, we don't believe that people are going to burn for zillions of years for the sins of one lifetime. It's longer than zillions. Some people believe they're going to burn forever and ever. The Bible tells us there is going to come a world where there's no more pain, no more death, no more sorrow all things are made new, and so we see that ultimately it says the wicked are burned up. That's Malachi 4. We do have a study guide I was going to tell you about the subject of the millennium and that title is--

Pastor John: A Thousand Years of Peace.

Pastor Doug: We'll send that to you--

Pastor John: Anyone who calls it in.

Pastor Doug: That's a test.

Pastor John: The number is 800-835-6747. You can ask the study guide called A Thousand Years of Peace. You can actually read that study guide for free online as well. Our next caller is Donna listening in California. Donna welcome to the program.

Donna: Thank you. I appreciate you taking my call. My question deals with the Book of Revelation 14:9-11. What I'm wanting to know is who is going to have to be present during the destruction of the wicked basically? Because what I'm reading here in chapter 10 is that it's only going to be the holy angels and the lamb that will be present. I'm hoping it means that we won't have to watch this. [laughs]

Pastor Doug: Well, I don't know how close our seats will be, but--

Donna: I hope they're not there at all.

Pastor Doug: Obviously the wicked are being punished after the second coming of the resurrection, and since we are with Jesus, and we are being gathered by the angels I think it's understood that we're still in the neighborhood when this happens. Because it does say the presence of the lamb and the holy angels, but I think that--

Pastor John: If you're talking about the destruction of the wicked that occurs at the second coming of Christ, if you read the sequence given in the Bible I don't think our focus is going to be much on what's happening on the earth when Jesus comes. Our prime focus will be up in the air, and we'll be looking up. Christ will be on the cloud, the angels will be there, we'll be caught up. There'll be a glorious resurrection and loved ones will meet again. The real focus for the redeemed is not going to be what's happening behind them. They're not going to be looking over their shoulder. They're going to be looking up into the air, and they're going to be caught up to meet Jesus in the air. That'll be a glorious event. It'll be the climax of the human history is when Jesus comes.

The response of the wicked, Revelation 6 says, "They turn to the rocks and mountains and say, 'Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him that sits upon the throne and from the wrath of the land'. The great day of His wrath has come who shall be able to stand". So the wicked are gripped with fear.

Donna: This torment and torture, that happens at the same time as the righteous are being raised. This is a part of that?

Pastor John: Well, there's two destructions of the wicked. You have the first destruction that occurs when Jesus comes, but--

Pastor Doug: That's a living wicked.

Pastor John: The living wicked.

Pastor Doug: Yes.

Pastor John: Then at the end of the 1,000 years, you have what the Bible calls the great white throne judgment that you read about in Revelation 20, where all the wicked are resurrected for the final judgment. Then they mount this last effort to try and attack the Golden City, the New Jerusalem, and Revelation says fire comes and devours them. The righteous will be inside the city, they'll be safe, but the wicked are outside the city, and they're consumed by the fire.

Pastor Doug: Now there is a verse where you read in Luke 13:28 where he says, "There'll be weeping and gnashing of teeth when you see Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets, all the saved in the kingdom of God and yourselves thrust out". It does seem that there's at least a brief point where the saved are going to see who's saved and the lost are going to see who's lost and it's going to be a very sobering moment at that time. I believe she'd also enjoy the study guide you mentioned on the Millennium, A Thousand Years of Peace.

Pastor John: Yes.

Pastor Doug: We have a study guide on the judgment too.

Pastor John: Right. Both of them would be good. They deal with the subject Revelation 20. Just call and ask for the study guide called A Thousand Years of Peace and--

Pastor Doug: Your Day in Court.

Pastor John: -we'll send that to you and also Your Day in Court I believe is what it's called. I think that might be the name of the book.

 We can send that as well. The number is 800-835-6347 that is the resource phone line. We're going to go to our next caller who is listening in Washington, we have Lee. Lee, welcome to the program?

Lee: Hi guys, can you hear me?

Pastor Doug: We can.

Lee: Okay. My question is the Bible teaches us that we should love our enemies, does that mean that God still loves and has compassion for Satan who is the ultimate enemy?

Pastor Doug: Well, that's a good question. The Bible says God is love. I don't think that God stops being love even though the devil has rebelled. Keep in mind, a parent might have a child that turns into a real rebel but that doesn't mean that their parents stopped loving them even if they're thrown in jail on death row. I don't know that God stops being love and that the Lord doesn't like what Satan has become which is he's become consummate selfishness and evil. We're not being encouraged to love the devil [laughs] when he says love your enemies. I think that the love that we have for our enemies is Jesus, his love broke people's hearts and converted them. The devil is never going to be converted, he's never going to repent. I don't think we ought to waste that affection for him, his doom is sealed. Whether God stops loving, there's a different question and that's hard for us to comprehend. He is a God of love but there's no salvation for the devil. Thank you, Lee, we turn your volume down a little bit because we had some background sound effects. Did that answer your question?

Lee: Yes.

Pastor Doug: It did?

Lee: Thank you.

Pastor Doug: All right. Thank you. We do have a steady guide that says did God create a devil and he talks a little bit about that subject.

Pastor John: To receive that just call our resource phone line that's 8008356747 and you can ask for the study guide called, Did God Create the Devil?


Speaker 1: Want to know God's plan for our world and solutions to your life's challenges? Beautifully redesigned Amazing Facts' 27 Bible study guides provide encouraging Bible-based answers to questions on healthy relationships, when Jesus will return and much more. Prefer to watch while you eat? Our brand-new prophecy encounters DVD series makes the perfect companion set. Order your study guides and DVD today by visiting or am I calling 800-538-7275.

Pastor John: Our next caller is, Orlando or it is somebody calling from Orlando, not quite sure. Orlando you're on the air?

Tim: Hi, this is Tim from Orlando.

Pastor John: Tim. All right. Well, the reason we had to ask that is, believe it or not, Pastor Doug and I know a pastor who lives in Orlando and his first name is Orlando.


Yes, I wanted to make sure.


Tim: My question is I'm a little confused because as a New Testament believer, we're always taught that Jesus is the only way to the Father and the only way to go to heaven and my question is, as it was in Noah's day, Noah the Bible says, "He was a preacher of righteousness." Of course, we know he built the ark and this and that. I'm just wondering why was Noah preaching back in that day? We talked about this in Sunday school this morning and the pastor really didn't have a defined answer as far as there was no sermon recorded of what he was saying. He gave there's some Hebrews reference about Noah. What was Noah preaching? I find it odd that there was only Noah saved his family on the boat and we don't know how many people were there but I would just think there would have been some stragglers that came on the boat just out of curiosity but there was only eight people. I'm just wondering what the message was?

Pastor Doug: Good question Well, he's called the preacher of righteousness and the Bible says, of course, Noah found grace. Keep in mind, it tells us one of the first things Noah did when he got off the ark is he offered sacrifice. Even the people who lived before the flood understood those sacrifices pointed to the day when God's son would come. That's why John the Baptist said, "Behold the Lamb of God takes away the sin of the world." He was saying that there could be forgiveness for their sins they had to get on the boat and repent.

Pastor John: We have a little bit of an idea of what Enoch was preaching. You actually find in the Book of Jude. It's the book just before the Book of Revelation, Jude chapter 1:14, says, "Now, Noah the seventh from Adam prophesied about those [crosstalk]'

Pastor Doug: You mean Enoch? You said Noah.

Pastor John: I'm sorry, it was Enoch.

Pastor Doug: That lived at the same time.

Pastor John: They were, yes.

Pastor Doug: Enoch was a preacher of righteousness. What did he say?

Pastor John: Well, that's too bad. I was so excited to share this, I wasn't listening. I thought he said Enoch. Anyway, it's a good question. "Behold the Lord counts 10,000 of his Saints," to talk about the same kid of--

Tim: Is it true that people in the Old Testament, they got saved by just knowing the glory of God, just in Creation itself before Christ? What happened in the Old Testament?

Pastor Doug: Well, they were saved by grace. Yes. Even in the Old Testament-- because God had talked to Adam face to face, in the Old Testament they understood the plan of salvation. You read in Revelation it talks about the lamb slain from the foundation of the world. When Adam and Eve sinned, they tried to cover their nakedness with fig leaves and God said, "No, it's going to require a skin." That's when the sacrificial system was introduced. The Bible says Abel believed in the blood of the lamb and you can read about that in Hebrews. That Abel he trusted in the blood of the lamb, Cain didn't want to believe in the sacrifice that pointed to the son of God. Even these guys that lived before the flood, they were safe looking forward in faith to the sacrifice of Jesus. They were saved by grace, nobody's saved by words. We've got a better understanding because Jesus finally came so we're saved by faith looking back but everyone is saved by faith. Very good question. I appreciate that so much. I'm trying to think what we have on that. Last Night on Earth, we're talking about Lot's wife.

Pastor John: Yes. It might be a good book.

Pastor Doug: Talks about the time of Noah, too.

Pastor John: The number to call is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the book called, The Last Day on Earth. Our next caller is Rebecca listening from Michigan. Rebecca, welcome to the program.

Rebecca: [unintelligible 00:46:07] finally meet you, sir.

Pastor Doug: Likewise.

Rebecca: I have a question, I have low self-esteem and I need some help to deal with this biblically.

Pastor Doug: All right. Well, first of all, if you want to know better what you are worth, I just did a message on what a soul is worth, and oe of the ways you determine what something's worth is by what a person is willing to pay. They say it's worth whatever someone will pay. What did someone pay for your soul that God so loved you that he gave his son, which means that that's the most valuable price that anybody's ever paid for anything is the creator himself gave himself to redeem you. Now, we sometimes when we say self-esteem we've got to be careful because God certainly wants us to understand our self-worth but you don't want to be so self-conscious that it then turns into pride and selfishness where you're preoccupied with what you're worth, this too dangerous. You get one who doesn't think they're worth anything and some who think they're worth too much. There's a balance there for the Christian.

When we're crucified with Christ, we don't worry all the time about what other people think of us because we know what God thinks of us. Sometimes low self-esteem is because we're so concerned about what others think of us and we don't think we're worth a lot to them. When we know what we're worth to God that gives you the best balance and centering emotionally. The only one that we're really concerned about is what does God care and what does he think of us? We really appreciate your question and hope that helps a little bit.

Pastor John: Teresa listening in Alabama. Teresa welcome to the program.

Teresa: Hi.

Pastor Doug: Hi. Thanks for calling.

Teresa: You're welcome. My concerns was/is it biblical to tithe off of your pension?

Pastor Doug: Yes. If you have earned a pension through your work over the years that when you get a percentage back, why wouldn't you want to pay a tithe on the increase?

Teresa: I have been. I just wonder is it biblical though because I don't know where it was in the Bible but I know it was an income coming in?

Pastor Doug: It varies from one employer to another how the pension fund is built. Some government pensions you don't ever really-- you work two years and you can get a 40-year pension. That's an exaggeration but other people, the pension money is money that you've taken out of your paycheck every pay period and you've already basically paid tithe on it because if you're paying on the gross income it's your money that you're putting into a fund. Sometimes employers add to it which would be new money and then you'd want to pay tithe on that. It could get complicated but to keep it simple, I just find you can't out-give God. God says, "Prove me. See if I don't open the windows of heaven and pour out a blessing take care of you." Whenever you're in doubt do the faithful thing.

Teresa: Okay. Thank you.

Pastor Doug: All right. Thanks. We do have a study guide we'll send you for free on the subject of tithe and it's called, In God we Trust, you'll really enjoy it.

Pastor John: The number to call these 800-835-6747. You can ask for the study guide called In God we Trust. Our next caller is Lois listening in Washington. Lois, welcome to the program.

Louis: Hi. Good evening pastors.

Pastor Doug: Evening. It's Lewis, right?

Louis: Louis. It's a Mexican name.

Pastor Doug: Your question?

Louis: My question is about the feast. I've been studying with some people who keep the feast and they bring this passage to me. I cannot remember right now, but Paul uses this, he says, "I'm going back to Jerusalem for the feast." Why is he saying that and is this one of the feasts the same ones that Moses command?

Pastor Doug: Paul is going back to Jerusalem during the time of a Jewish feast. He wasn't doing that because he was requiring all Christians to keep the feast. Paul says clearly, "I have become all things to all men that I might bring some to Christ." Paul says to the Jews, "I became as under the law that I might reach those who run to the law." In other words, Paul said, "Look, in order to relate to the Jews, I'm going to go back and I'm going to observe the feasts and I'm going to try and meet them on their ground." He wasn't saying that everybody now needed to keep the feast because other places like Romans 14 and Colossians 2, Paul's very clear. He says, "One man regards one day above another, another man regards every day alike. Don't let anyone judge you regarding the Sabbath days that are shadows of things to come. In Galatians, he talks about circumcision.

Ross: I got that all clear out. It's just that they used a passage. I'm like, "I don't have that."

Pastor Doug: I was in the Philippines and on Easter, I went to a festival to videotape something. My going there didn't mean that I believed or agreed with the festival. By Paul saying, "I'm going to celebrate this feast with them," well, when he was a Jew growing up that's what he did and now he's trying to reach his Jewish friends and family so it just states it as a fact.

Pastor John: Paul also realizes this was a great evangelistic opportunity. You had Jews traveling from across the Roman empire that would just come to Jerusalem for these special feasts. What an opportunity to share with them about Christ and do evangelism.

Pastor Doug: We do have a book released that talks about the feast and it's called Feast Days and Sabbaths. I've just written a new book because we get so many questions on the feasts which should be in pretty quick here because it's all done. It's called "Should a Christian keep the feasts?" You call Amazing Facts and we can send you a copy of that.

Pastor John: Our next caller that we have is Tom, listening from South Carolina. Tom, welcome to the program.

Tom: Hey, thank you. Howdy Doug, how you doing [unintelligible 00:52:06]

Pastor Doug: I'm doing good. Howdy to you too and your question tonight.

Tom: Good to hear from you. I've seen you lots of times at [unintelligible 00:52:12]

Pastor Doug: Bless your heart, yes, camp meeting there, it's a beautiful place.

Tom: Yes, sir. I want to ask you a question and I'll leave you alone. I've read in the Bible where he talks about-- I don't know the passage Doug, promise-- the grapes and the fruit in heaven is going to be tremendously bigger.

Pastor Doug: Well, that is actually assumed. Some people look at the story where the 12 spies go and they look at the Promised Land and they come back and the grapes are huge and that we assume other fruits were very big. Some have speculated that means that in heaven, if the gate's made of a single pearl, yet it tells us that Joshua and Caleb brought back these huge clusters of grapes, how much bigger will the fruit be in heaven. I don't think Pastor Ross, there's a verse that says the size of the fruit. It's just understood.

Pastor John: [crosstalk] eat food in heaven with different food trees.

Pastor Doug: It says, "Every man'll eat from his own vineyard and his own fruit tree" but it doesn't talk about the size of it. I think it's safe to assume if they were that big in the heavenly Promised Land, they'll be bigger still. Good question. If I'm wrong, when you get to heaven, I promise that I'll apologize but I can almost guarantee you come to my house and there'll be some pretty big grapes. We're going to call them grapefruit.

Pastor John: Next caller that we have is Peter, listening in Connecticut. Peter, welcome to the program.

Peter: Hello.

Doug: Hey, Peter, you're on the air and I think we got about three minutes.

Peter: My question is a quick question. I know about the godhead but I just can't find the Trinity inside the Bible. Can you help me out with that?

Pastor Doug: Well, you're not going to find the word Trinity. You're not going to find the word millennium in the Bible. A matter of fact, you don't find the word Bible in the Bible. Trinity's just a theological term that means tri or three, like a tricycle's got three wheels, entities. It's the three persons of the Godhead. Nothing wrong with the term. In the Bible, it talks about God's eternal godhead but the teaching of the three persons of the Godhead, the Father, Son and Spirit is found throughout the Bible from creation where God says, "Let us make man in our image," to the baptism where you see God the Father in heaven, God the Son, is in the water and God the Spirit is coming down like a dove and Jesus is baptized in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Spirit. There's a number of verses, matter of fact, there's a book. We'll send you a free copy. It's called the Trinity Isn't Biblical. I wouldn't put much weight on the word Trinity, that's just a descriptive term but, the teaching of the three persons of the Godhead, I believe that is biblical. We'll send you a free copy of that book if you just ask.

Pastor John: The number to call is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the book called the Trinity isn't Biblical. We'd be happy to send it to anybody who calls and asks. [unintelligible 00:55:15] we're looking at the engineer over there on the other side of the glass. We're wondering how much time we have. Looks like we have a minute. It might not be enough time for us to take another caller. We'll probably end up cutting their call short. You did mention a website on the break. We just want to repeat that one more time if there were those who joined us. Just a great website for those who want to study the Bible in-depth, in particular, the time periods that we read about in the Bible.

Pastor Doug: Yes, it's fascinating. It's got illustrations. You can click on the different Bible characters, little windows pop up to give more information, tells when they were born, when they died, some are question marks but you'll be able to see how their lives overlapped, see that Samson lived just a little while before David. It just helps you realize who their heroes were and the timescale. It's called We know you'll enjoy that. Friends if we didn't get your call this week, God willing we'll be back next week and we'd love to hear from you.


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