Change Is Coming Through the Shadow

Lesson: 1
“Mold me, fashion me, raise me into a holy atmosphere,” (COL, 159). The earthly sanctuary was but just a hint, a shadow of the Heavenly. And us, if we could be a shadow of Christ, miniatures of Him, what could be achieved ? Perhaps our families could witness His character through us, perhaps those that wonder why bad things happen to good people could understand faith through us. Perhaps change could happen, a consuming conversion as we behold Him to become like Him. Join us to learn more.

God Drew the Plans

God Drew the Plans
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Announcer: It is the best-selling book in history. No volume ever written has been more loved and quoted; and its words, sometimes simple and sometimes mysterious, should always be studied carefully. It is the Bible, the Word of God. Welcome to "Bible Answers Live," providing accurate and practical answer to all your Bible questions. This broadcast is a previously-recorded episode. To receive any of the Bible resources mentioned in this broadcast, call 800-835-6747. Once again, that's 800-835-6747. Now here's your host from Amazing Facts International, Pastor Doug Batchelor.

Doug Batchelor: Hello, friends. Would you like to hear an amazing fact? English dye casters Leslie Smith and Rodney Smith founded Lesney Products in 1947. And along with their partner, Jack Odell, they began making small toys. In 1952, Odell was challenged by a rule at his daughter's school. The rule permitted students to only bring toys to school that were small enough to fit inside a matchbox. So, he scaled down Lindsey's little steam roller package and put it in a matchbox and sent his daughter off to school. The Matchbox car was born. Since 1953, Matchbox cars have sold around the world. The first little car sold for 39 to 48 cents and came in a small matchbox-like container. The toys are made by measuring real, full size cars or trucks with a laser and then reducing the dimensions to be about 1/64th the size of the original model. To date, there have been more than 12,000 individual Matchbox models with a total production of over three billion miniature toy cars and trucks. You know, the Bible speaks of three structures that were made as miniatures of heavenly copies.

Jëan Ross: That's right, Pastor Doug. When you think about the Matchbox car, I think just about every little boy, at some point in time, has seen one or played one or I know [inaudible]

Doug: You've got a few boys. Did they have?

Jëan: They sure did.

Doug: We've still got a bucket, I think, of Matchbox cars in the attic.

Jëan: And I think what's appealing is that they look just like the real thing, but, of course, miniature.

Doug: And then shrunk.

Jëan: That's right. That's kind of neat to look at it and say, "Wow, this is what the real thing looks like." Well, you know, the Bible talks about a miniature structure that was recreated here on the earth.

Doug: That's right. The Bible tells us that when Moses went up Mount Sinai, not only did he get the Ten Commandments, but he received a lot of the laws, both civil, health, and religious while he was on the mountains, and God gave him plans, specific plans. The same way Noah was given specific plans for the ark, God gave Moses specific plans to build a tabernacle, a sanctuary that was a miniature model of a heavenly sanctuary that you read about several places in the Bible. And one example would be-- you can look in Hebrews chapter 8, verse 4. It says, "For if He were on earth, He would not be a priest, since there are priests who offer gifts according to the law, who serve the copy and shadow of the heavenly things. As Moses was divinely instructed when he was about to make the tabernacle." That's the sanctuary. "For He said, 'See that you make all things according to the pattern shown you on the mountain.'" Like, we know the Ark of the Covenant was the golden box of the Ten Commandments. On the top, there were golden angels.

Well, in heaven, God doesn't sit enthroned between two golden statues of angels. He sits between living angels. Just like a little Matchbox car--well, the doors don't open. I mean, it's a little model, but the very real temple in heaven, instead of having a wallpaper with angels like the earthly sanctuary, it's probably a living wall of angels that surrounds the Lord. And I said three, because there are three times it was built. You've got the mobile tabernacle in the wilderness. Then Solomon ultimately built, at David's instruction, and David provided for it, one of the wonders of the world, the temple of Solomon. And that was then destroyed by Nebuchadnezzar. And after the Babylonian captivity, it was rebuilt during the times of Ezra and Nehemiah, later refurbished by Herod the Great, but it was basically the same temple. And so these are all miniatures of the heavenly model, and that temple teaches us, Pastor Ross, something about how God saves people.

Jëan: That's right, the Bible says, "Thy way, O Lord, is in the sanctuary." So, looking at the services of the sanctuary, of course, you've got the sacrifices that took place in the sanctuary that the priesthood and the work that the priests did, and all of the articles of furniture, they all teach a lesson that points us to the plan of redemption in Jesus our sacrifice and also great High Priest. And also, living the Christian life, that's also present in the sanctuary. So, we do have a study guide that talks about the sanctuary that's called "God Drew the Plans," and this is our free gift. We're going to send it out to anyone who calls and asks. The number for that is 800-836-6747. You can ask for Offer #129 or ask for it by name. It's called "God Drew the Plans." You can also dial #250 on your phone and say, "Bible Answers Live," and then ask for "God Drew the Plans." You can also receive the free gift that way.

I would also like to greet those who are listening on some radio stations that we have across the country. We want to greet those tuning in on KWRG in Arizona. Those who are listening there, welcome. And also KPGC in Arkansas. So, if you have a Bible question, and you're listening through these two, one of these two radio stations, we'd love to hear from you tonight. And for anyone who has a Bible question, the number to call is 800-463-7297. That's 800-God-Says, 800-463-7297, and that'll bring you here into our program. We also want to greet those who are watching on YouTube and Facebook, also on AFTV, and some other networks that are going to be rebroadcasting this program. We thank you for being a part of our Bible study.

Well, Pastor Doug, before we go to the phone lines-- I know there's quite a few callers waiting-- let's start with prayer. Dear Father, we thank you once again that we do have this time to open up your Word and study. The Bible is the most important book, a book that you have given us to show us the way of truth. The Bible says that "Thy Word is a lamp to our feet." So, guide us, Lord, as we study together. In Jesus's name, amen.

Doug: Amen.

Jëan: Well, our first caller this evening is Brittany, and she's listening in California. Brittany, welcome to "Bible Answers Live."

Brittany: Hey.

Doug: Hi.

Brittany: Yeah, my question is why do bad things happen to good people? And are the past week's events part of the sign of the times?

Doug: Yeah, that is a great question. And, you know, I--for those who are listening, sometimes these programs are rebroadcasts, and last week, at the time of this recording, there was another school shooting. Innocent kids were killed, and a lot of people just have very serious questions. I think there's so much evil in the world with innocent people suffering at the hands of wicked. And why does God allow this? If He's a loving God, if He's all powerful, why doesn't He just stop it? If there's a devil, why would God make a devil, if He's a good, loving God? And people have a lot of questions.

First, I'd recommend that anyone who has those questions, if you have not seen the "Cosmic Conflict" DVD--and, of course, it's on YouTube--just type in Cosmic Conflict, and you'll see a DVD that was produced. It explains where did evil come from? Why does God not just destroy the devil as yet? He will, the Bible tells us. And why are there innocent people suffering here in this world? But you read in the book of Job, where Job was a good, just, upright, righteous man, and just all these terrible things happened. The book of Job sort of gives you a picture behind the scenes, that the bad things that happened to Job came from the devil, and there's--the devil has highjacked this world, because our first parents were made free, and God said, "Don't disobey and eat this forbidden fruit," and the devil said, "Listen to me, don't listen to God." And when Adam and Eve chose to listen to the devil, they really kind of handed over the keys of our world. They surrendered dominion of this world to the enemy.

Paul says in Romans chapter 6 that "Whoever you obey, that's whose servants you are," and they basically gave the world to the devil. Even Jesus refers to the devil as the prince of this world. So, that's why there's so much suffering. We ought to be asking the question, since the penalty for sin is death, "Why aren't we all dead?" It's the goodness of God that protects us and is giving us some probationary time to make another decision to choose Jesus and choose forgiveness. Good question. And I think we've got a lesson on "Did God Make a Devil?"

Jëan: We do, but we also have a book that might be a little more directed to your question. It's called, "The Brook Dried Up." Why do Christians suffer? And that's free. We'll send it to anyone here in the US and Canada. The number to call is 800-835-6747, and you can ask for the book, "The Brook Dried Up," and we'll be happy to send it to you. If you're listening outside of North America, we want to encourage you to go to our website at Click on our free library, and you'll be able to read the book right there online. It's called, "The Brook Dried Up." Gary in Illinois. Gary, welcome to the program.

Gary: Thank you. In Revelation 16:9, it says that men are scorched with a great heat, and they did not repent. Well, this could be, you know, solar flares. So, my question is are natural disasters and the bowls of the wrath of God one and the same? And that's why people aren't repenting when these, you know, horrific, extraordinary natural disasters happen?

Doug: Yeah, well, through history, not connected with the seven last plagues, but through history, I think that God has sometimes allowed natural disasters as a judgment, but not every natural disaster is from the Lord. You read in the book of Job, we just referenced, the Bible says the devil went forth from the presence of the Lord, and he brought a tornado that killed the children of Job. The house blew down. And we had tornadoes this last week. It doesn't mean God sent them. Sometimes the devil can even influence nature. He was the most powerful of God's creation, and he's got a lot of power even over the weather. But the seven plagues, many of them appear to be nature reacting somehow. Many of the seven plagues are sort of similar to the plagues that fell on ancient Egypt, namely the blood, the sores, and the darkness on the seat of the beast. People being scorched with great heat, it may also be connected with something happening in the atmosphere or solar flares.

Jëan: Yeah, I mean, God often uses natural things to do a judgment. For example, in the case of Egypt, when the plagues came, there were literal locusts that infested the land. So, God can use the sun, but it's clearly an act of judgment that comes. Why do the people not repent during the seven last plagues? Well, at that point, the Holy Spirit has been withdrawn from those who have rebelled against God. Probation is closed, and we go through what we call the great time of trouble that you read about in Daniel chapter 12, verse 1. So, people's minds are pretty much made up at that point. And instead of these plagues bringing them to a point of repentance, the Bible says that they curse God, they blame God, they blaspheme His name for sending the plagues. So, they know where it's coming from, but their hearts are hard, and they're set in doing evil, and the plagues reveal that.

Doug: Yeah.

Jëan: All right, thank you. Next caller, we're going to try Gerry one more time. Gerry in Texas, are you there?

Gerry: I'm here, guys, finally. Hey, thanks, Pastor, for taking my call.

Doug: Yeah.

Gerry: I have several Bible texts in reference to the question I'm asking. And, you know, you have to get spiritual knowledge through that. What is the true physical nature of His physical nature? We have in Genesis angels held swords, and we have Paul in Acts 19:15-16 that the men that were wanting to get the Holy Spirit, the angels there pounded on them you know, beat them up or so. And then we have Roger Moray's dog was kicked by an angel. And then in Ezekiel, I guess we have that Satan had fire erupt from his abdomen, in his wings. I guess he did have a crown.

Doug: Yeah, so it seems sometimes, you know, one place it says that the angels--and Pastor Ross says, I think, they're his ministering-- It says they're spirits. We don't wrestle against flesh and blood. That's Ephesians 6. But also in Hebrews, when it talks about the angels, they are ministering spirits that are sent forth to minister for those who will inherit eternal life.

Jëan: Hebrews 1:14.

Doug: Thank you, that's the one. So, we've got several verses that tell us that angels are spirits; but at the same time, we see them interacting in a physical way with our world on many occasions, where they are moving things and doing things, both good and bad angels. Typically, the devil, when he interacts with the environment, he does it through a creature or a person that's possessed. I mean, even the demons cast out of the man, they said, "Put us in the pigs." You know, do something like that. And Satan, he operated through the medium of a serpent, but they are able to somehow interact with our dimension, and so they are very real creatures. I think the confusion comes in that we don't understand what the spiritual realm is.

We assume that when something's spiritual, that means that it has no substance the way we understand it. But there's a whole dimension that in which the angels live and operate. And I would just say to everyone listening, the miracle by which you're listening now or watching on television, we didn't know about 100 years ago. We didn't know about radio waves, and those frequencies, and gamma rays, and x-rays, and there's a whole world that we can't see, we now understand. Well, I don't think we've yet figured out the equipment to diagnose and measure the spiritual realm, but it's very real. And so angels somehow are able to interact with our physical world when they choose to reveal themselves. The Bible says Satan can appear as an angel of light, and they can do miracles, and they can move things. So, it is something of a mystery.

Jëan: All right, well, thank you for your call, Gerry. We've got Johnny listening in Kentucky. Johnny, welcome to the program.

Johnny: Hello, thank you. I was wondering, do you have any advice on how to witness to family members who are running away from God and spend nearly all their time on violent video games, violent movies, and violent media in general?

Doug: Well, you know, there's three things you can do for the people you love. And I know it's heartbreaking when you see people you care about and you love that don't seem to be interested in eternity and the Holy Spirit and serving God. But there's really only three. I say three, and it's technically four things that you do that you, when you want to reach somebody. The one is you be a good witness. Let your light shine. The other would be pray for them. God does things when you pray that would not happen otherwise. Prayer really does make a difference. The other is if they're open, share information. So, if you've got friends, and they're preoccupied with watching media that's not good, say, "Hey, I've got this video. It's called "Cosmic Conflict." Or "I've got this video called, "The Bride, the Beast, and Babylon." These are a couple done by Amazing Facts. Say, "You really would enjoy this." And if they're open--but sometimes you can't, you know, your friends won't listen. They won't read material. They won't watch something you give them. So, the fourth thing is you do the first three persistently. Don't give up. Pray for them, be a good witness, and share information when they're available. Don't nag them, don't badger them with information, because you can drive them away. You don't want to do that, but keep praying their hearts will be open, and study with them, if they're open.

Jëan: Absolutely. And, of course, that's something we need to do. We need to be the best witness that we can for our family and our friends, and we need to pray that God gives us wisdom to know when to speak or when to be quiet. So, that's something that we need to be connected to God with. We've got Carly listening in--is it Nebraska? Carly, welcome to the program.

Carly: Thank you very much and thank both of you for having this program and being there. I have a verse, Colossians 1:24, that I have never really understood, and today in my daily reading I've come across something that has a brand-new thought that kind of bothers me, when I read it, and I wanted to run it by you.

Doug: Well, let me read the verse for our friends that are listening. I'll read Colossians 1:24. Is that right?

Carly: Yes, and I understand that Paul is not speaking of Christ's suffering here, that he's explaining to the people his own sufferings—

Doug: Yeah, let me read it real quick for those listening. "I now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up my flesh in what is lacking in the afflictions of Christ, for the sake of His body, which is the church." Okay.

Carly: Well, I never quite understood the lacking part, and I, what I read was, like I say, a brand-new thought, that there's been several explanations, but it could be possibly that this text indicates Christ's afflictions did not end after His ascension, and I'm reading this now, and that consequently He continues to identify Himself with the church, that as the believers fulfilled the mission of the church, Christ is now being afflicted by the afflictions of believers, suggesting that he is somehow experiencing them in Himself. And He says this will come to an end at His return in glory. And I thought, Christ isn't afflicted anymore, and the thought that He's being afflicted?

Doug: Yeah, well, let's talk about that. That's an interesting observation. You know, it tells us in the Bible that Jesus is not physically, you know, He's in heaven now at the right hand of the Father. He's not physically suffering on the cross anymore. He was crucified once. Jesus does feel everything. And so He said, "Inasmuch as you've done it to the least of these, you've done it to me." So, whether we do something kind or whether someone does something evil to another person, Christ feels the pain in that, you know, He empathizes with the pain of His creatures. So, in that sense, He suffers. Paul is probably not referring to that here. When he talks about the afflictions of Christ, I think he's talking about where Peter said that, you know, "Don't be shocked if we share in His sufferings; but if we do, rejoice." And Paul, probably more than any apostle, he did go through a lot of hardship and sufferings. He was beaten, and stoned, and imprisoned. And so he said, "Look, you know, I killed Christians, and the Lord is letting me taste some of those sufferings now." What do you think?

Jëan: Yeah, I think so. You know, He said, "My strength is made perfect in weakness." And Paul was an example of faithfulness, even despite terrible suffering. And then, of course, you read about Paul's list, and you mentioned some of them. Another one was shipwrecked, imprisoned. Eventually, he was beheaded for his faith. So, you know, Christians can look at that and say he had so many things happen to him; and, yet, look how positive and convinced he was of the love of God. Look at how strong his faith was. So, he's an example. And, you know, Paul is acknowledging there my affliction is probably not over. There's probably more that's going to come.

Doug: That's right. And when he said, "Fill up the measure of suffering," he meant sometimes God has to let us suffer to learn things. And Paul said, "I'm still learning." So, God's going to fill it up.

Jëan: Yeah.

Doug: All right, thanks so much. I hope that helps Carly.

Jëan: We've got Anna listening in Oregon. Anna, welcome to the program.

Anna: Hi, thank you for taking my question, again, guys.

Doug: Thank you.

Anna: So, my question is--you probably get it all the time--but the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. And sometimes I think I get it, and then I don't, and then I do, and then I don't. I would like you to explain it to me.

Doug: Yeah, well, you know, it'll be hard in 3 minutes to explain God. The Bible says His ways are higher than our ways, than the stars are above the earth. And Job said God is past finding out. So, you know, if we ever got where we could wrap our brains around God, someone who's lived from everlasting to everlasting, that made the cosmos, you know, it's quite literally a mind-blowing thought. But there is information revealed about the functions, for lack of a better word, of the Father, Son, and Spirit are different. I heard you explain it once, Pastor Ross, in kind of three phases. Do you know what I'm talking about?

Jëan: You've got to remind me.

Doug: Actually, well, you know, the Father's the authority, and Jesus is the medium that reveals the Father. He's the one who saves us. And the Holy Spirit is, He's going and doing the bidding of the Father and the Son, and leading the teaching, the convicting, the guiding, and there's verses that support these things. You know, Jesus even said, "God the Father created all things through the Son." So, God the Father seems to--there's a willing submission of the Son and the Spirit to the Father, because the Father is the one who so loves the world, He sends His Son. And then you've got the Father tells us He commits judgment to the Son. He commits creation to the Son. The Spirit you see, of course, right there at creation, is there in every facet of creation and salvation, and He's sort of constantly the one communing between the Father, and the Son, and the Spirit. Anyway, we do have a book that is called, "Understanding the Trinity, and we'll be happy to send you a copy of that, Debbie. Is that Debbie asking that? No, that's Anna. I'm sorry. And, hopefully, that'll help a little bit.

Jëan: The number to call for that is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the book, "The Trinity: Is It Biblical?" We'll be happy to send it to you. The next caller that we have is Debbie. Excuse me. Listening in Canada. Debbie, welcome to the program.

Debbie: Hi, how are you?

Doug: Good, thanks for calling.

Debbie: Okay, first of all, I want to say, Pastor Doug, I still have your "Richest Caveman" book with your signature in it. I remember fighting over--not fighting, but pushed my way through a crowd to get you to sign it. Unbelievable book. Changed my whole life.

Doug: Oh, praise the Lord.

Debbie: Yeah. Okay now, the question I have is not really--I would think it would be a biblical--I'm trying to keep my body clean-- well not trying, I am. But when I die, I just filled out my health card, and they ask you, a question on the health card, protégé thing is do you want to be an organ donor?

Doug: Yeah.

Debbie: Do you want to donate your organs? And I said yes. Is that against Bible principle?

Doug: Well, it's a great question. I had to ask myself the same question. My driver's license also says yes just because I know I'm getting a new body. And if, you know, if there's any of my parts that are of any use--and the older you get, the less likely that is--but, you know, if, you know, if there's some part that is going to give someone else sight, that--we lost a son about 20 years ago, and they asked us, they said, "You know, would you be willing to donate his cornea that could be transplanted in someone else to help them see?" And we said, "Absolutely." Because, otherwise, it's just, you know, it's going to turn back into ashes, the Bible tells us. And so--and we feel the same way. Now, I don't think that--I don't support cremation, because that's just basically, you know, burning up your body. But, you know, if there were some parts that could help another person have life, Jesus is all about sacrifice for others.

Jëan: Yeah, there's no biblical reason not to.

Doug: No moral dilemma there.

Jëan: Absolutely, if you can help. All right, we're going to jump to James in Texas. James, welcome to the program.

James: Yes, sir. My question is, I intend to be re-baptized on Easter Sunday.

Doug: Oh, wow.

James: But is there going to be--is there a special order for my repentance? Like, is there baptism, confession, repentance, or any kind of special order I have to end up doing?

Doug: Yeah, well, you'll read in Acts chapter 2, when the people said to Peter, after Peter preaches his sermon-- and I forget--it's like verse 38 maybe--they said, "Men and brethren, what shall we do?" Peter said, "Repent and be baptized." And John the Baptist, he said, "Repent and be baptized." So, repentance is a sorrow for sin and a willingness to turn away from sin. It's a U-turn where you turn from your old ways and you would walk in a newness of life. That should definitely come before baptism. So, it's like if baptism is like marriage, and if you're going to marry a particular girl, she's going to say, "I want to make sure you're done dating all the other girls before we get married." You don't say, "Well, after we get married, then I'll try and stop dating the other girls." So, you want to--it doesn't mean you need to be perfect before you're baptized, but you should, you know, express sorrow for your sins, confess your sins to God, repent from your sins, and then when you are baptized, you have followed the criteria, you then come from the water, and all your sins are forgiven, and God says He cleanses you from all unrighteousness when we confess our sins.

Hey, friends, you can tell we're going to take a break. Don't go too far, because we've got a lot more Bible questions coming, and I think we've got a special offer we can make available to Glenn when we come back. God bless.

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Announcer: Doug Batchelor was the teenage son of a millionaire father and show business mother. Yet, he was living in a cave. He had everything money could buy, everything but happiness. But all of the fun and excitement he enjoyed left his life out of control. His search eventually led him to a cave above Palm Springs that became his home. While Doug scavenged for food in garbage bins, his father owned a yacht, a Lear jet, and an airline. But in his cave home, he discovered a dust-covered Bible. As he began to read, he soon learned of his true purpose in life. "The Richest Caveman" is the extraordinary true story of Doug Batchelor that tells how a rebellious teenager who once lived in a cave became a tremendous soul winner for Jesus Christ. It's a thrilling testimony of the transforming power of God's Word. To order your copy of "The Richest Caveman." Call 800-538-7275 or visit AFBOOKSTORE.COM.

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Announcer: This broadcast is a previously recorded episode. If you'd like answers to your Bible-related questions on the air, please call us next Sunday between 7 p.m. and 8 p.m. Pacific time. To receive any of the Bible resources mentioned in this evening's program, call 800-835-6747. Once again, that's 800-835-6747. Now let's rejoin our hosts for more "Bible Answers Live."

Doug: Welcome back, listening friends, to "Bible Answers Live." And we've been doing this program for over 27 years now. If you've got a Bible question, then you just can give us a phone call at 800-God Says with your Bible question, and we'll do our best to answer it. We've got some Bible resources at the tips of our fingers here. We're streaming now on Facebook. That's the Amazing Facts Facebook page, the Doug Batchelor Facebook page, and YouTube, the Amazing Facts YouTube page. We're on AFTV and a number of other stations, radio and television. My name is Doug Batchelor.

Jëan: My name is Jëan Ross. And we've got Hughley listening in Pennsylvania. So, Hughley, welcome to the program.

Hughley: Hi there. How are you?

Doug: Good, thank you for calling.

Hughley: All right. So, I had a question for you. I basically wanted to know about what the symbolism was with Ezekiel and the wheel. What was that encounter like?

Doug: Yeah, you not only find the wheel within the wheel here in Ezekiel chapter 10. It's also mentioned in chapter 1. And you can read in Ezekiel 1, it says, "Now as I looked at the--" And this is Ezekiel 1:15. "Now as I looked at the living creatures, behold, a wheel was on the earth beside each living creature with its four faces. And the appearance of the wheels and their workings was like the color of beryl. And all four had the same likeness." And he says that--you go on, it says, "The appearance of their workings was, as it was, a wheel in the middle of a wheel. And when they moved, they went towards any of the four directions, and they did not turn aside as they went. For their rims, they had so high, and they were awesome." And then it says, "Their rims were full of eyes all around." And I've had people say, "Well, this is Ezekiel saw a UFO, or he saw an alien. And folks have all wondered what is this? It's a wheel within a wheel. It's like a watch or the gears inside. Or is it some kind of a Caterpillar where you've got the tracks turning the wheel within a wheel? And people have been all over the map with this.

But Pastor Ross, as far as I know, Ezekiel is having an apocalyptic vision here, and so there's symbolism. And the idea of a wheel within a wheel is telling us that, you know, God is really in charge of all time, and the idea that there's eyes all around, it means He has His interactions that are helping make every little providence happen and that God is completely in control. The purpose of Ezekiel's vision, he's trying to wonder why these terrible things happen to the nation of Israel. They're conquered and carried off, and by the Babylonians, and then the Persians, and God is saying, you know, "I'm working out my perfect plan. And to you, it may look like a wheel within a wheel, but everywhere those wheels go, there's a direction and a purpose. So, it is a mystery.

Jëan: And if you look at the throne room described in Revelation chapter 4, it talks about the four living creatures, and it says there are six wings, and they have eyes. So the symbol of eyes being all knowing. God is aware of everything. And then the wheels, the throne of God appears to move. So, there are some parallels, I think, in describing God's throne, as you see it in Revelation, but also the symbolic application of that.

Doug: Yeah.

Jëan: Absolutely.

Doug: And the four creatures are very similar in Ezekiel to the ones you see, if not identical, to the ones you see in Revelation. So, I hope that helps a little bit. All right, Glenn, we sure are--sorry, that was Hughley. We sure appreciate your question.

Jëan: The next one caller that we have, we're going to try Glenn one more time, I think. Glenn, are you there in Ohio? Glenn, welcome to the program.

Glenn: Yes, thank you very much for taking my call. I hope we made it through this time.

Doug: You did, you're on.

Glenn: Good. My Bible study, I'm studying in the wonderful book of Zechariah, the 8th chapter, and I got to verse 19, and it talks about the four fasts, of four months, the fourth month, fifth month, seventh month, and tenth month. I'm concerned what that fast is about and what calendar is it talking about? Can you help me?

Doug: Yeah, I think he's referring back to the feasts that you'd find in Leviticus, where you've got the-- what was it? Seven annual feasts, and some of them involve fasts. There were days of fasting. And so this would be what they called the spiritual calendar that began with the Passover. Now, Israel had both a civil calendar that was a little bit different from their religious or spiritual calendar. And in the Jewish spiritual calendar, they had their fall festivals, and then they had their spring festivals, and then there was the Day of Atonement, which was the last festival at the end of the spiritual year. And I know there was a fast at the beginning of Passover, and there was also a feast with Passover. So, they had both. And I'm pretty sure that Zechariah is also talking about those fasts that you find there.

Now, we do have a book we can share that talks about "Jesus and the Feast Days." And I looked on our new lineup of books, and we do have a book that talks about the feast days, yeah. So, if Glenn wants to call--I'm sorry. Is that Glenn, is that right? Yeah, if he wants to call and ask for that, we'll be happy to share that.

Jëan: The number to call for that is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the book on "Jesus and the Feast Days," and we'll send that to anyone here in the US or in Canada. The next caller that we have is Ty, and he's listening in Minnesota. Ty, welcome to the program. Ty, you're on the air, hi.

Ty: Hi.

Doug: And your question.

Ty: Why hasn't God destroyed Satan?

Doug: Okay, good question. Why doesn't God just destroy Satan? Well, you know, when children sometimes disobey their parents, parents are very loving and patient. They want their children to understand and obey them, because they love them, because what they're asking is good and reasonable. That's the reason that God did not destroy the devil right away, is He did not want the other angels obeying, because they were afraid they were going to get killed if they didn't disobey. God doesn't want us motivated just by fear of punishment. God wants us to obey Him because we love Him. And the devil was accusing God of some terrible things, so God had to allow Satan to demonstrate to the world what was going to happen. He's showing the world by His patience that following the devil leads to all kinds of pain. People had to find out and see what was going to happen. So, you would enjoy--tell your parents to help you watch the "Cosmic Conflict" DVD. It's free. You can watch it online. Just go to YouTube and type in Cosmic Conflict. It's the one with Pastor Doug, and you'll see it there. Thanks so much, Ty.

Jëan: The next caller that we have is Terry listening in Tennessee. Terry, welcome to the program.

Terry: Thank you, Pastor Ross. Hi, Pastor Doug. Are you guys all right?

Doug: We're doing great. Thank you for calling.

Terry: No, thank you.

Jëan: And your question?

Terry: Hello.

Doug: Yeah, you're there.

Terry: Yeah, yeah. It's not so much on the Scriptures, but I just kind of wondered when the exiles that were put in Babylon, when Jeremiah was a prophet, they stayed there 70 years, and then they returned, okay.

Doug: Mm-hm.

Terry: Why didn't they set up the kingdom like it was before the exile? With their own king and everything from the house of David?

Doug: Good question. Yeah, they would loved to have done that; but when they were allowed to go back from Babylon to Israel, they did it under the rulership of the king of Persia. In other words, all they could do was have a governor. And so the king of Persia said, "You don't have a king anymore. I am the king, and you will pay tribute to me. But I'm going to give you your freedom, and you'll have your own governor." And from the time of the Babylonian captivity, there may have been a brief period where they broke away from the Greeks during the time of the Maccabees. But other than that, they were under the Persians, then they were under the Greeks, and then they were under the Romans, and then the Romans destroyed the city. They never had a monarchy again. But when Jesus comes, He is the Son of David that will reign over the New Jerusalem. So, all the promises about Israel and God's people inhabiting the world will be fulfilled in the Son of David, Christ, when He establishes His kingdom. Thanks so much. I hope that helps a little bit.

Jëan: All right, we've got Terry listening in Virginia. Terry, welcome to the program.

Doug: Another Terry. Welcome.

Terry: Yes, hi. Thank you for taking my call.

Doug: Yes, and your question.

Terry: Is 1 Corinthians chapter 11:1-16, Paul's opinion or is it a message from God? And how should we understand it, please?

Doug: All right, well, you quoted a lot of verses, but I think you're talking about where it talks about women covering their heads when they pray, and that's the section, if I'm not mistaken, right?

Terry: Right.

Doug: Yeah. So, the big question that people have here is was this a custom or was this a commandment for every people in every age, that women should not pray in public without having their heads covered. And most of the commentaries believe that Paul is addressing the custom of respect during his time. There's no command in the Old Testament we can find where it says a woman must cover her head when she prays or when she's in worship. You do have examples of women that were praying in public. It doesn't tell us what they might have had on their head. I would say, first of all, if a person feels convicted about this, well, by all means do it. You know, if you go to Russia, still a lot of the Orthodox churches, the woman always cover their heads when they pray, and I've worshiped in Pentecostal churches, years ago, whenever they prayed, they covered their heads, if a woman was praying in public. And but Paul mentions later in the verse--and I'm trying to remember where it was--he said, yeah, verse 16, he says, "If anyone seems to be contentious, we have no such custom, nor do the churches of God."

So, he's using the word "custom" there, and it makes us think they're talking about a custom of respect. This is the only place this is mentioned. So, you know, I don't know that they had these apostle Taliban that were telling all the women that they had to cover their heads or get thrown out of the church. But there was a custom, and they were having problems in Corinth. Some have said that, you know, the immoral women in the cities, they used to braid their hair with chains of gold and leave it uncovered. And so to show that you are a believer, that you would cover your hair, which was your glory, as a sign of submission to God and even your husband. So, this is the understanding I've seen from those verses.

Jëan: All right, I think the point there is showing respect and reverence.

Doug: Yeah.

Jëan: And, of course, that's applicable not only to women, also to men. In our culture, if a man enters into a church, and he's wearing a hat, the appropriate thing is to remove the hat, a sign of respect. If you go to different cultures, in other places around the world, they also have different types of customs. You go to some places where you have to wear a hat.

Doug: Yeah, you go into a Jewish synagogue, you put the hat on. So, you go to some churches, you take your shoes off.

Jëan: Right, right. So different places, but the principle there is the same, showing reverence and respect.

Doug: Thank you, Terry.

Jëan: We've got Bryan listening in Oklahoma. Bryan, welcome to the program, Bryan in Oklahoma.

Bryan: Hi, thanks Pastors. I appreciate y'all's ministry.

Doug: Thank you.

Bryan: So, my question is, is I think I've heard Pastor Doug refer to Moses as a Christ type or a type of Christ.

Doug: Yes.

Bryan: And I was wondering if you could explain that for us.

Doug: Yeah, there's probably many ways where you could find typology, how Moses is a type of Christ. First of all, you don't want to get it from me. You listen to what Paul says in 1 Corinthians chapter 10, and he shows how the whole Exodus experience is an allegory of salvation. They were saved from the bondage of the devil, as we are saved from the bondage of--they were saved from the pharaoh as we're saved from the devil. Moses was born from slaves, but he never served as a slave. And Jesus was born of humans, but He never sinned. Moses was what we call a mediator. He would go up the mountain, and God would speak to him, and he'd bring the message, and then they'd talk to Moses, and he'd bring the message to God. And Jesus is our mediator. Moses was interceding for the people. He would lift up his hands, and they would win the battle. He stretched out his hands, and Jesus stretched out His hands.

The word Moses means drawn from the water. Moses is actually an Egyptian word. They even had some pharaohs that were called Tut-Moses. It means drawn from the water. And Jesus, you know, the Bible tells us in Revelation 17, the waters represent multitudes of peoples and nations. Jesus came from the people. He came from the slaves to save the slaves, and Jesus came from humanity to save humanity. So, you've got Amram and Jochebed had three children. You had a trinity of children, and they were all prophets--Miriam, Aaron, and Moses--all prophets. You have the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit. They've got all kinds of illustrations. And Moses had to die just before they crossed over. Jesus had to die for us to be able to cross over.

So, I could go on and on. I have a book I wrote on this. Matter of fact, we're doing a new study series called "Shadows of Light" on types of Christ in the Bible. Moses is one of those lessons. But there's a book. You can just go to Amazon and type in "Shadows of Light," Doug Batchelor, and you'll see our book where I've got a whole section on Moses.

Jëan: All right, very good, thank you. Next caller that we have is Kay, listening in Michigan. Kay, welcome to the program.

Kay: Well, thank you. I have just a quick question for you. Sixty-six years I've been in the church, and I've always thought I knew about the clean and unclean foods. And my husband was listening to STR the other night, and a pastor on there said he could not find in the Bible where you could not eat duck. And I can't find it either now, but all my life I've been told no. What is your opinion?

Doug: Well, first of all, I'd say if you're in doubt, do the safe thing. So, don't eat it. But I do believe, at least in the King James Version, it refers to swans as being unclean fowl. And ducks and swans are in the same category. I can't remember the scientific genus of how you say that. But, you know, ducks are not a foraging bird. The clean birds were usually the foraging birds that go around. They peck. Karen and I were walking today, and we got surrounded by a herd of turkeys. Are turkeys a herd? Anyway, and, you know, they go around, they peck, they eat seeds, they eat bugs, and there are pheasant, quail, they're all the clean birds, the partridges, so forth. They were safe for sacrifice. You never see them sacrificing a duck or a swan. So, I would say they're in the unclean category. They usually muck around in the lakes. They just have a whole different diet. Anyway, I hope that helps a little bit. Thank you.

Jëan: Thank you, Kay. We've got Mark listening in Arkansas. Mark, welcome to the program.

Mark: Yeah, I was really having a hard time. A lot of times we keep charging our acts and the influence of the evil ones, and my understanding was Jesus says that we've been led astray by our own natural tendencies. And so I went to Jeremiah, the prophet Jeremiah, and he was trying to tell us that the human heart is deceitful above all things, and sometimes even desperately wicked, and that we fall into something like foolish fears, diverse lusts, envy, enslaving pleasures, malice, envy, and even vengeful hatred. So, it seems to me that we are our own enemy, and Satan really ain't our enemy. It seems to me that we are. Maybe I'm wrong, but if you're not connected to the vine, Jesus Christ, then it's kind of hard to produce good fruits. And I just was wondering what you thought about the prophet Jeremiah, to tell us.

Doug: Well, absolutely, I agree completely with the prophet. I agree with all the Word, but I agree with Jeremiah that the Bible does teach that an unconverted person, the human heart is selfish and desperately wicked. We all inherited these fallen natures from Adam and Eve. And, originally, God created man to be motivated by love. But because of sin, the compass was broken. The needle now points inward instead of outward. Instead of pointing it away from ourselves and loving God, and loving others, it points to love of self as first. And then but when you're born again, through the Holy Spirit, you get a new nature, and you start learning, through the Spirit, to love, and old things are passed away. All things are become new. You have new motives and new desires, and it doesn't change all at once, but many things can change just through prayer and accepting Christ, where you get the Holy Spirit. You start thinking about love for God and how much He gave, and we love Him because He first loved us. We love others because we see how much He loves others. And yes, the unconverted heart is evil and desperately wicked. The Bible says, "All we, like sheep, we've gone astray. We've turned each one to his own way. The selfish, unconverted heart turns to its own way. But when we encounter Jesus, and we're born again, we're made new creatures, things change, and that's called conversion, and that's what we all need to be praying for. Keep our eyes fixed on Jesus, we become like Him.

Jëan: All right, thank you, Mark. We've got Megan listening in Canada. Megan, welcome to the program.

Megan: Hi, thank you for having me.

Doug: Thanks for calling.

Megan: My question is about 1 Corinthians chapter 13, verse 1. I've always understood tongues to mean languages. But where it's talking about "if I speak in the tongues of men or of angels," that made me wonder what is speaking in tongues of angels? Because I'm wondering if that's what some people use to explain, like, sometimes there's, they would say they're speaking in tongues, but it's not something that can be translated.

Doug: Yeah, I think you need to continue reading. Well, first of all, I'm sure angels do have a language. So, I don't doubt that for a moment, because they do communicate. Man is made a little lower than the angels, and we speak. I'm sure the angels speak. But when Paul says, "Though I speak with the tongue of men and angels, and have not love, I'm just a sounding brass or a clanging cymbal," Paul was not saying that he spoke with the tongue of angels. The word "though" means even if, because you read on. He says, "And though I have the gift of prophecy and understand all mysteries and have all knowledge," well, clearly, Paul did not understand all mysteries and have all knowledge. "And though I have all faith so I can move mountains, if I have not love it's nothing." And then he says, "And though I give my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned--" Paul did not give his body to be burned. He didn't give away all his goods to feed the poor. So, Paul is saying that even if you do all these wonderful things--he didn't say he did them all. So, when he says, "Though I speak with the tongues of men and angels," Paul is just using an illustration there. He is not saying that he or anyone in the world speaks with the tongue of angels. So, does that make sense, Megan?

Megan: Yes, it does. Thank you so much.

Doug: Okay you know--thank you. And do me a favor. There's a book we'll send you for free. And anyone who wants to understand the gift of tongues a little better, and these very verses, and just call, and we'll send it to you, no strings attached. No one's going to knock on your door and try and sell you any hallelujah oil or anything. Just call and ask for the book, "Understanding Tongues." We'll send you a free copy, and Pastor Ross will give you the number.

Jëan: The number is 800-835-6747. And, again, you can just call and ask. We'll send it to you for free. It's called, "Understanding Tongues." You'll be blessed if you'd call and receive that. You can also dial #250. I almost forgot about that. And you can just say, "Bible Answers Live," and then ask for the book called, "Understanding Tongues," and we can send it to you. Let's see, we've got Robert listening in Washington. Robert, welcome to the program.

Robert: Hey, Pastor Ross and Pastor Batchelor.

Doug: Hi.

Robert: Hi there. Glad I could be squeezed in.

Doug: Yes, sir. And your question?

Robert: It's regarding a thing that I've heard before, people saying that once we die and go to heaven, there's three levels of heaven: celestial, telestrial, and terrestrial. And I've heard that it's supposed to be in 1 Corinthians 15, I think 37-42, something like that.

Doug: Yeah.

Robert: But that's the only place that it's referred to, but I've always thought there's just one, there's only like we either die or else we live forever. There's only two options, I thought, but some people tell me that there's three.

Doug: Yeah, the--I don't think that 1 Corinthians 15, verse 35 and 40, rather, where it says there are celestial bodies and terrestrial bodies and the glory of the celestial is one body, the glory of the terrestrial is another. There's also the glory of the sun and the moon. The three heavens that it speaks about, that Paul talks about, it's not talking about this. It's a completely different teaching, a different-- what do you call it? It's a different application. The three heavens, they had the heaven that was the atmosphere around the earth. Then they have the heaven that was the starry bodies of space. You can call them the celestial. Then they have the heaven that is the dwelling place of God. That's called the third heaven. When Jesus comes back, it says, "I'll make a new heaven and a new earth." The heavens and the earth that now exist are going to be burned up, meaning the atmosphere in the world. You know, God separated the heavens from the heaven there in Genesis. The atmosphere is going to burn up. That's one heaven. When it says that you've got the stars in heaven, that's in the moon, and the sun, and the stars, and the heavenly bodies. That's the celestial bodies. The heaven where paradise is, the dwelling place of God is the third heaven. So, I wouldn't make a strong tie between 1 Corinthians 15:40 and the three heavens.

Okay, Pastor Ross, we've got 2 minutes. What can we do in that time? Can we squeeze in half a call?

Jëan: Absolutely, we've got, let's see, D-Rod listening from New Jersey. D-Rod, welcome to the program.

D-Rod: Hello, gentlemen, how are you doing? I have a quick question about climate change. It says in the book of Matthew like it was in the day with Sodom and Gomorrah, and the days of Noah. Climate change. What's the cause of climate change? To me, it's sin. I just wanted to know.

Doug: That's a good question. You know, I'm kind of rushing, because we're against the clock here. But, you know, the Bible tells us that the earth waxes old like a garment, and the earth is being crushed under a burden of sin. And some, no doubt, man has had an impact on the environment. You know, how much the warm and cold spells that are in the extremes in weather are affected by, you know, man's construction and CO2. There's all kinds of debates about that, but there's no question man is impacting the environment, just in the deforestation and stuff. I wish I could say more, but we are out of time.

Friends, don't go away, because we sign off. Our regular listeners know that we've got people listening on satellite radio. They're on a different clock than the land-based stations, so we will be bidding them farewell in just a moment, but we're going to stay by and answer some rapid fire Bible questions that have come in from those who email us questions. Some people don't want to call. They say, "I'd just like to email it and listen off the air." What's the address to do that, Pastor Ross?

Jëan: That's the email address.

Doug: Okay, You can send us questions. For the rest of you who are listening on satellite stations around the country and other parts of the world, God bless. We'll look forward to studying with you next time. The rest, stay by. We'll be back momentarily with rapid fire Bible questions.

Announcer: Thank you for listening to today's broadcast. We hope you understand your Bible even better than before. "Bible Answers Live" is produced by Amazing Facts International, a faith-based ministry located in Granite Bay, California.

Jëan: Hello, friends, welcome back to "Bible Answers Live." We want to thank you for your email questions that you've sent in. We're going to try and get through as many of these questions as we can. And as we mentioned before the break, if you have an email question, just simply send it to All right, Pastor Doug, the first question comes from Harry. He's asking, "What is the sign mentioned in Matthew 24 that talks about the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven?"

Doug: Yeah, well, some have wondered is that, like, when Elijah said he saw a cloud the size of a man's hand coming as a signal that the storm was coming? Or is it where the Bible says the heavens will depart as a scroll when it is rolled together, and all the stars fall out of their place? It's going to be some cosmic splitting sign that I think everyone will recognize. Because Jesus said it's like lightning going from one end of the sky to the other. So, something, when you look up, says every eye will see when He comes. So, something's happening in the sky that's going to be unmistakable.

Jëan: Okay, another question that we have, "Is the Spirit referred to in Genesis 1, verse 2, is that the Holy Spirit? And if so, is it the Spirit of the Father or the Spirit of Jesus?"

Doug: Well, the Holy Spirit is not just talking about the Spirit of the Father, the Spirit of Jesus. The Holy Spirit is the third person of the Godhead, and He is equally connected with God the Father and God the Son, and yes it is the same Spirit. You find the Bible beginning in Genesis, it talks about water and the Spirit. And then you go to Revelation. It says, "The Spirit and the Bride say, 'Come.' Whoever is athirst, let him come and take the waters of life." So, you've got the Holy Spirit and the waters in the beginning and at the end of the Bible. It's God the Spirit.

Jëan: Okay, we've got Ty asking from the UK. "Are the 144,000 symbolic or literal?"

Doug: Yeah, good question. You know, I think people think the 144,000 are the only ones that are going to be saved in the last days. On the Day of Pentecost in the upper room, you have the 12 apostles that were filled with the Holy Spirit, plus there was 120, and then a great multitude was baptized through them. In Revelation 7, when it talks about the 144,000, they're not the only ones. It says through their ministry, have a great multitude that comes out of the final tribulation that no man can number. So, they're not the only ones saved, but it may be a literal number, just like the 12 apostles was a literal number. So, whenever you look at the 144,000, just think they're like last-day apostles. They're certainly not the only ones saved, but they've got a special work.

All right, listen, friends, now we're serious. We're out of time. We hope that you'll let us know that you're blessed by the programs. Connect with us. Study the Word,, back next week.

Announcer: "Bible Answers Live," honest and accurate answers to your Bible questions.

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