Butch O’Hare

Date: 08/15/2010 
Despite his involvement in organized crime, Easy Eddie tried to teach his young son right from wrong. He wanted his son to grow up to be a better man than he was.
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How about an amazing fact? Al Capone virtually owned Chicago. He was notorious for enmeshing the Windy City in everything from gambling to murder. Capone had a lawyer named Easy Eddie. Eddie was very good. In fact, Eddie’s skill at legal maneuvering kept Al Capone out of jail for many years. Despite his involvement in organized crime, Eddie tried to teach his young son right from wrong. He wanted his son to grow up to be a better man than he was. Yet with all of his wealth and influence, there were two things that he couldn’t give his son: he couldn’t pass on a good name, or a good example. One day Easy Eddie reached a difficult decision. He decided to testify against Al Capone in an attempt to clean up his reputation, and to set a good example for his son. He knew that it was a dangerous decision. And within the year, his life ended in a blaze of gunfire on a lonely Chicago street. His efforts, however, to teach his son a better way, did not go without results.

Several years later, during World War II, a fighter pilot assigned to the aircraft carrier Lexington took off with his squadron on a mission in the South Pacific. After airborne, Butch O’Hare looked at his fuel gauge and realized that someone had forgotten to fill up his tank. He would not have enough fuel to complete the mission and then get back to his ship. Reluctantly he dropped out of formation and headed back to the fleet. On his way back, he saw something that turned his blood cold, a squadron of Japanese planes headed straight towards the American fleet. Laying aside all thoughts of personal safety, he dove into the formation of Japanese planes firing at one plane, and then another, until all of his ammunition was spent. He then continued his assault by weaving in and out amongst the enemy planes trying to clip a wing or tail. Finally the exasperated Japanese squadron took off in a different direction, and Butch limped his badly damaged plane back to the carrier.

The film from the gun camera on the plane told the story. It showed the extent of his bravery to protect his fleet. He had in fact, destroyed five enemy aircrafts. This took place February 20, 1942. And for that action, he became the first navy pilot to win the Congressional Medal of Honor. A year later he was killed in aerial combat at the age of twenty-nine. His hometown named their airport in his honor, the Chicago O’Hare International Airport. Now, what is the connection between Butch O’Hare and Easy Eddie? Well, Butch was Eddie’s son. He learned from his father the lesson of doing what is right at any cost. Did you know friends that the Bible tells a story of another son who did what was right at an incredible cost? Stay tuned for more as Amazing Facts brings you this edition of Bible Answers Live.


Pastor Jëan Ross: Good evening friends, this is Bible Answers Live. Pastor Doug Batchelor is out this evening. My name is Jëan Ross. I’d like to welcome you to this live, national and international Bible study. The phone lines are now open, and if you have a Bible related question, the number to call is 1-800-GOD-SAYS, that’s 1-800-463-7297. Now I have a treat in store for you this evening. Sitting with me here in the studio is Dr. DeRose. He is a physician at the Weimar Health and Education Center. Dr. DeRose, thank you for joining us here on the program tonight.

Dr. DeRose: It’s great to be here, Jëan.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Now, the unique thing about Dr. DeRose, not only is he a physician but you’re also a pastor.

Dr. DeRose: Well, I have been a pastor. Right now I’m keeping my hands full with medicine, but it’s medicine with a focus of ministry and spiritual ministry is a large part of what we do at Weimar.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Absolutely. So friends, here’s you opportunity, if you have a question related to health--especially as it might relate to the Bible--Bible has to say about health, we would love to hear from you tonight. We do have, well, it looks like two lines that are still open, and the number to call to the studio is 1-800-GOD-SAYS, that’s 1-800-463-7297. Now Dr. DeRose, we recognize that the Bible is God’s word.

Dr. DeRose: Amen.

Pastor Jëan Ross: And in order to correctly understand it, we need the Holy Spirit to guide us.

Dr. DeRose: Exactly, right.

Pastor Jëan Ross: And so, before we go to the phone lines, will you start our program with a word of prayer.

Dr. DeRose: Sure. Father in heaven, we come before you, dependent on you to guide our minds, to lead us in deed into all truth. Please be with us throughout this hour that we may think your thoughts, and communicate your words. We ask in Jesus’ name, amen.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Amen. Well, we opened the program this evening speaking about Butch O’Hare, and his father Easy Eddie, quite a story there.

Dr. DeRose: Amazing story.

Pastor Jëan Ross: We don’t often realize. I know you have flown through Chicago O’Hare as I have a number of times, and for any of our listeners that have been there, I believe it’s the center terminal of the Chicago Airport. There is a display of Butch O’Hare, kind of tells you a little bit about the history, and why the named the airport after his name. Of course, it doesn’t tell you in that display about his father, Easy Eddie…

Dr. DeRose: No, I don’t recall reading about that.

Pastor Jëan Ross: …and the relationship between the two. It’s kind of neat. When I read that fact, I couldn’t help but think of, of course, Jesus, the Son of God, who sacrificed so much for our salvation. I’m reminded of the verse in Philippians chapter 2, and I’m beginning here in verse 8, it says, “Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus,” “Who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God.” In other words, He was equal with the Father, but He made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a born servant and became in the lightness of man. And being found in the appearance of a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, and then this last little phrase, there in verse 8, it says, “Even the death of the cross.”

Now, what a condescension for Christ. The creator to become one with His creation, for Jesus to give the shape of the universe back into His Father’s hand and to take upon Himself humanity, that in itself is just a tremendous act of self-sacrifice. But then to become our surety and to die in our place because of our sins even reveals to a great degree His amazing love, not just any death but the death on the cross. To die in a cross was probably, if not the most painful, one of the most painful ways that anyone can ever die. It was geared specifically for maximum torture and pain to those who died on the cross.

There’s also some further significance to dying on a cross. We’re reading the Old Testament, where God commanded the Israelites if in battle, they killed an enemy, and they hung the body of the one that they had killed on a tree, they would take it down when the sun set. They wouldn’t leave it overnight. And then you read in the New Testament where Paul says--and he quotes from the Old Testament--“Cursed is everyone that hangs upon a tree.” So for Christ to hang upon the cross, it was more than just a physical agony of suffering there on the cross but He really bore the curse of sin for us so that we can have salvation and be saved. Friends, you might want to know more about this great sacrifice of Jesus, and we have a free book we’d like to give you if you’d call our resource line. The book’s entitled, “Three Steps to Heaven.”

Not only does it talk about what Jesus has done for each of us but even more importantly, how can we receive the blessings of Christ’s sacrifice on our behalf. If you call 1-800-835-6747, the number again is 1-800-835-6747, and ask for the book “Three Steps to Heaven,” we will be happy to send that out to you. The number here to the studio, and we’ve got just one or two more lines open, 1-800-GOD-SAYS, that’s 1-800-463-7297. We’re going to go to the phone lines now. Our first caller is De Barry, calling from Charlotte, North Carolina. De Barry, welcome to the program.

De Barry: Hello.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Hi. And your question this evening?

De Barry: I have some studies this weekend, and I had a question about Revelation17:10, about the seven kings. I want to know who are the sixth and seventh king.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Revelation chapter 17, verse 10 is your question. Let me read it so that those who are listening and don’t have a Bible can kind of follow along with us. It says, “And there are seven kings: five are fallen, one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he comes, he must continue a short space.” Now, if you back up a little bit more and read the context of Revelation chapter 17, it’s a description of a woman that is riding upon a scarlet colored beast. A woman in Bible prophecy often represents a church. For example, in Revelation chapter 12, you have a pure woman standing upon the moon. That would represent God’s people, God’s church. In Revelation 17, you have this woman riding the scarlet colored beast. It would represent an apostate church or an apostate power. And then as it goes on it gives different descriptions of the beast. The beast would have these seven heads. And then over here in verse 10 of Revelation 17, it talks about these heads of the beast and what they represent it says, “They represent seven kings.”

Now, according to the Book of Daniel, a king can also represent a kingdom. Many scholars identify these seven kings as being the seven principal kingdoms that fall against God’s people, and that would be Egypt. Of course, the children of Israel were in captivity for four hundred and thirty years in Egypt. You’ve got Egypt, you’ve got Babylon, you’ve got Assyria, you’ve got Babylon, Medopersia, Greece and Rome. So some would suggest the five that are fallen, that would be Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Medopersia, Greece. The one that is, that would be Rome, and the one that is to come, he must continue for a short space. That would be this revived antichrist power that we read about in some other parts of the New Testament. Does that help?

De Barry: It does. And one more question--can I ask you two questions?

Pastor Jëan Ross: Sure.

De Barry: This is Revelation 13:3.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Revelation 13; verse 3.

De Barry: I want to know when was deadly wound healed.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Alright, let me read that again. It says, “And I saw one of its heads as it was wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.” Now again this beast power is synonymous with the antichrist that we read about in other places in the New Testament. This beast power received its deadly wound back in 1798, the wound began to be healed around 1928, I believe, when the medieval church once again received its not only religious power but even some of its political power. The wound is not completely healed because if you read on Revelation chapter 13, it describes a time where this beast power will force all the world to eventually receive the Mark of the Beast. And, you know, that’ a huge subject and probably take a little more time than we have right here to just try and explain on that, but hopefully that’ll give you a little bit of an idea of what the passage is referring to.

You know, we do have a study guide that deals with this very subject and we just touched sort of the tips of the iceberg here. But De Barry or anybody else that is listening, if you would like to learn more about this, you can call our resource line and ask for the study guide, “The Antichrist: Who is the Antichrist?” And we also have a study guide entitled, “The Mark of the Beast,” just real fascinating and important subject. To receive that, call our resource line 1-800-835-6747. Again the number is 1-800-835-6747. Well, we’re going to go to the next caller. We have Joanna, and she is calling from Lincoln, California. Joanna, welcome to the program.

Joanna: Hi, sorry Pastor, this is a dog farm, (Unintelligible).

Pastor Jëan Ross: Okay.

Joanna: I’m hoping it’s not too noisy here.

Pastor Jëan Ross: No problem, we can hear you. Go right ahead.

Joanna: Oh, good. I have a question about pairs. I know in Luke chapter 10 how Jesus set up the seventy-two in pairs, and the Lord chose to do that. And I was reading in Mark, the first couple of chapters in Mark, and I noticed in chapter 2; verse 14, that Levi, the son of Alphaeus was sitting at the tax office. Now, I’m assuming that Levi is also Mathew. And then I happened to notice in the next chapter, in chapter 3; verse 18 that James was the son of Alphaeus too. So I thought, “Hmm, that’s interesting, that means James and Mathew are brothers, and we know that Peter and Andrew are brothers, and James and John are brothers, so that say six of those twelve disciples who were in pairs as brothers. So I’m wondering if there’s any other biblical evidence or anything else that would tell us about the other six, and were there other brothers, and I would just like to hear your insights on that.

Dr. DeRose: I think one of the things we always have to be careful is when we try to pair two names together. A lot of these names were very common in Bible times. Joanna, I don’t think we have any evidence that we can nail down that this particular James and Mathew were actually brothers. Do you have any insight into that?

Pastor Jëan Ross: No, actually it could be. It could be.

Dr. DeRose: Yeah, right.

Pastor Jëan Ross: And that’s the interesting thing. They didn’t play that prominent position as far as brothers go like you do some of the other brothers that were disciples, Peter, James and John, they seem to play a far more prominent role. So it could very well be, Joanna. I mean, it’s a good observation. What about the other six? Does it say anything about them being connected or related? And the answer to that is no, not that we know of. It doesn’t speak about the others as being brothers. It is interesting though that God or Christ would call brothers to participate in His work, perhaps because of their family background, maybe the influence of their parents. He was able to use both of them for His work. But that’s a very interesting observation that you bring up.

Joanna: Yeah. Okay, well, thank you for your insights.

Dr. DeRose: Thank you.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Well, thank you for calling. I appreciate it. Our next caller is Eric, and Eric is listening on WBAJ from New Jersey. Eric, welcome to the program.

Eric: Hey, how are you?

Pastor Jëan Ross: Very well. And your question this evening?

Eric: My question is, as we know, by Jesus’ stripes we are held. And I heard a preacher once say that all of the major diseases and illnesses in the world could be linked back to thirty-nine different categories. I was wondering if there’s any way to see there’s a connection between the thirty-nine stripes that our Lord received in correlation to thirty-nine different categories of diseases and illnesses that’s in this world.

Eric: That’s a great question, Eric. I think it’s one for Dr. DeRose. You want to give a stab at that?

Dr. DeRose: Well, of course, the reference to being healed by His stripes comes from The Book of Isaiah, Isaiah 53. And the emphasis there is really speaking about total healing. Jesus bore our sins, He was the sacrificial servant. That’s the portrayal that Isaiah gives us. And, you know, a lot of times, we try to make connections in the Bible like you’re mentioning, you know, thirty-nine stripes, are there thirty-nine types of diseases, or is there some special significance to other numbers in the Bible? When we’re speaking about Bible prophecy, for example, the Book of Revelation, it gives us at the very beginning of the book, it says, “He sat and signified it or gave it by way of signs to John.”

There we are to look at the numbers largely symbolically unless there’s a compelling reason not to. But when it comes to something like the details of an account, Eric, we have to be very careful that we don’t jump to some conclusions that really aren’t warranted either by the text or by science in this case. And there is no classification of disease that would limit all diseases to thirty-nine categories. So I think that’s just making an application that although is clearly true in the sense that Jesus is the healer of everything, I don’t think there’s a direct connection between the number of stripes He was given and the actual number of diseases.

Pastor Jëan Ross: And of course, the Bible does tell us that Christ is the great healer.

Dr. DeRose: Of course.

Pastor Jëan Ross: And in the Bible we have numerous health principles that if we follow we will be healthy, and they will result in health and healing. We have a study guide that deals with the subject of what the Bible says about health. And, Eric, you might find this interesting; if you haven’t read it yet, it’s called “God’s Free Health Plan,” “God’s Free Health Plan.” It’s an Amazing Facts study guide and to receive that, just call our resource line 1-800-835-6747. 1-800-835-6747. Asks for the study guide, “God’s Free Health Plan.” I appreciate your question. Our next caller this evening is Osman, and he’s listening on the internet from Atlanta, Georgia. Osman, welcome to the program.

Osman: Hi, how are you doing?

Pastor Jëan Ross: Very well. And your question this evening?

Osman: Alright. My question is on Mathew chapter 19; verses 4 to 9. It’s about, like, when Jesus was facing the conflicts with the religious leaders about the marriage, did Jesus was talking about the remarriage, or He’s talking about simply divorce?

Pastor Jëan Ross: Well, let me read it and then we can talk about the specifics in the verse. Let me start over here in verse 7, it says, “They say unto him, why did Moses then command to give…”-- wait, wait, I’ll have to back up a little bit just to get the context--let me start in verse 4, that’ll probably be better, “And he said unto them, have you not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,” “And said, for this cause shall a man leave his father and his mother, and then shall cleave into his wife: and they twain shall become one flesh.” So he’s talking about marriage. “Therefore they are no more twain, but one. What God has therefore joined together, let not man put asunder.”

Then the Jewish leadership responded and said, “Why then did Moses command to give a written divorcement, and to put her away?” Christ responds to that by saying in verse 8, “Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so,” “And I say unto you, whosoever shall put away his wife, except for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marries her which is put away doth commit adultery.” Now your question there is, is Jesus referring to remarriage, or…

Osman: Yes, because the word ‘except’--when He say except, what does it mean exactly? Because that’s some other transition there, a lot of people say, they say, okay, when He say ‘except,’ that mean He give a license to the people who divorce somebody, they can remarry. (Inaudible 20:47) marry, that’s what I want to know.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Sure. If you just look at what Jesus says, He says that “in the eyes of God, the only legitimate reason for remarrying is if one of the marriage partners are not faithful,” and of course, that would be fornication is spoken of there. Now, that doesn’t mean to say that if somebody is in a dangerous position, perhaps they have an abusive spouse, they can’t separate from that individual. There’s nothing wrong with that. God doesn’t want people to be in a dangerous situation; or sometimes a couple might need to take a break for a little bit from each other. That’ not forbidden by Christ. But for somebody to get divorced and then remarried, the biblical grounds from what Jesus says, there needs to be fornication involved or adultery. Does that answer the question?

Osman: I think I’m a little bit confused about that verse because the discussion between Jesus and the Jewish people, He is talking about the divorce, but not the remarried, because that point come because we understand the situation of Israel people because they want to give a divorce for anything. But Jesus referred them in the beginning…

Pastor Jëan Ross: Oops, I think we lost you there, Osman. Hold on, let’s try and see if we can get you back. Osman, are you there?

Osman: Yeah, I’m here.

Pastor Jëan Ross: You’re still there. I’m sorry. We lost you there for just a moment. So, your question then is related to is Jesus saying that we can’t get divorce, is that the question?

Osman: No, no, no, I know Jesus say the way you can divorce, but the same way, is Jesus say you can remarry as you divorce, because the point is that if you married somebody, like, you know, you find your wife or husband commit adultery, is it the way like, you know, you can divorce your husband or your wife and you can remarry? That’s my question because the word except, what does it mean when Jesus say except? Is it the way for the divorce or is it the way to remarry?

Pastor Jëan Ross: I see what you’re saying. Alright, so does the ‘except’ relate to the divorce or the remarriage? I think from the context Jesus is talking about the remarrying part. In other words, divorce in God’s eyes is only legitimate if there is unfaithfulness by one of the married couple. Dr. DeRose, is that kind of how you see that?

Dr. DeRose: Yeah, I mean, it’s clear in the context He’s pointing His listeners back to the beginning, and God’s plan was that man and a woman would be joined for ever. So His plan was never a divorce, but the only grounds in the Bible that this exception that He’s mentioning is--the Greek it’s Porneia, or often translated fornication or immorality, it’s unchastity, lack of faithfulness to the marriage vow. So if someone’s not faithful to the marriage, then they have dissolved that union and that is the exception where a person can be divorced and then remarry in God’s eyes.

Pastor Jëan Ross: And of course, that’s not a mandate. If there is unfaithfulness within the marriage, you don’t have to get divorced. There’s many cases where there is genuine repentance. It’s a painful experience but God can restore love and harmony and unity within the marriage, so that’s sort of the last resort.

Dr. DeRose: Good point.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Does that help?

Osman: Oh yeah, thank you so much.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Thanks for your call. For anyone wanting to know more about the subject of marriage--you think, boy, we’ve got stuff on just about everything, and maybe we do--we’ve got a study guide dealing with the subject of marriage.

Dr. DeRose: Great.

Pastor Jëan Ross: And it’s called “Keys for a Happy Marriage.” To get that, call our resource line 1-800-835-6747. And we’re going to try to get another call in before we take our break. Hector is listening on the internet from Chicago. Hector, welcome to the program. Hector, you’re there? Yes, you’re on the air.

Hector: Yeah. Hi, good evening. I have a question with regards to Genesis chapter 3; verse 5, and then also jumping to Genesis chapter 3; verse 22, which is basically where Satan is talking to Eve, you know, if she eats her eyes will be opened, she will be like God, knowing good and evil. And then also the trinity of God, basically who know what Satan said was true? In chapter 2, her eyes were opened, she was like God, knowing good and evil. I just wanted to get some understanding of that, you know, why God would agree with Satan in that aspect, and what exactly does it mean that their eyes were opened, they’re like God, and they know good and evil?

Pastor Jëan Ross: Alright. Well, let me read that verse for those who are listening, and then we can talk about it, it says--this is Genesis chapter 3 starting verse 22, “And the Lord God said, behold, the man has become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever,” “Therefore the Lord God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.” Now, of course, in the beginning God planted a garden called the Garden of Eden, and into the garden He placed Adam and Eve, and He told them that they could eat of any tree in the garden except for the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. There was another tree in the garden called the tree of life, and they could eat freely of the tree of LIFE, but they weren’t to eat the tree of knowledge, of good and evil. That was a test of their loyalty. Now, God values freedom, and He gives every body freedom to choose to serve Him, or freedom not to choose Him. And that tree was an opportunity for them to exercise their freedom, and hopefully their freedom in choosing to do what God says.

But as you know the story, Adam and Eve chose not to do what God said, but to go along with what the serpent said, which of course, was Lucifer or Satan. Now, it was never God’s design, from the very beginning, that mankind have a knowledge of evil, that’s something that God didn’t want us to have anything or know anything about. When Adam and Eve disobeyed God, they did indeed receive a knowledge of evil. And today, we have a knowledge of evil. We know what the consequence of sin is. Now in the lie that Satan gave to Adam and Eve, he said, “Well, you’re not surely going to die.” God says, “You’re going to die, but you’re not going to die, instead you’re going to be like God.” Now, there probably was an element of truth in that, in that they came to know what evil was. But of course, that was a lie and that they did die. They reaped the consequences of disobedience. So in that case, we do understand a little bit more, but it was never God’s design that we understand evil, never His plan.

Hector: So, understanding evil I guess that’s reserved for God, understand good and evil?

Dr. DeRose: Well, the word know is being intimate with. And so God never wanted them to be intimate and have that experience.

Pastor Jëan Ross: And of course, God knows the end from the beginning. He knows everything. He knew what the seeds of rebellion in the mind of Lucifer would ultimately result in. And He didn’t want us to experiencer that. He didn’t want us to know that. A good question, Hector. We are coming up friends on our mid-hour break. Don’t go away. We’re just going to take a few moments break to give you some important announcements. And then we will be back with more information. You might want to get a pencil handy. We’re going to be giving you some phone numbers when we come back, as well as some great resources that’ll help you in your study of God’s word. You might even want to call a friend and say, “Hey, tune in your radio on and join us for Bible Answers Live.” Friends, we will be back in just a moment.


Pastor Jëan Ross: Good evening friends and welcome back to our second half of this program Bible Answers Live. The phone number here to the studio is 1-800-GOD-SAYS, that’s 1-800-463-7297. That’s 1-800-463-7297. Pastor Doug is out this evening. My name is Jëan Ross, and joining me here in the studio is Dr. DeRose. Dr. DeRose, before we go back to the phone lines, tell us a little bit about what’s happening at Weimar Health and Educational Center. I know a number of our listeners might not have any idea about what that is but it’s somewhat of a specialty that not only heals the body but also heals the soul.

Dr. DeRose: Weimar’s an incredible place. It’s a Christian health facility. And what we do is we really try to partner with Jesus in the healing process. Sometimes, as in the Scriptures, Jesus heals miraculously. But other times it seems that He wants to heal using simple, natural principles, educating people. Jesus spent much of His time teaching, as well as healing. So that’s the tradition we carry on at Weimar. We see people with all kinds of medical problems. Many come for our residential programs. People get off of medications, they avoid surgery, lot of people with diabetes, heart disease, high blood pressure problems, intestinal problems. Anyone can just go to out website which is NEWSTART because that’s what we really focused on, newstartforpeople.com and they can learn more about our program at Weimar.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Now, where is Weimar located?

Dr. DeRose: Weimar is about forty-five minutes outside of Sacramento, toward Lake Tahoe, in the foothills of the Sierra. It’s a beautiful country. Fifty miles of trails. We’re out in God’s country and we see God doing miracles all the time there.

Pastor Jëan Ross: So when one cooperates with God’s principles of health, He works in miraculous ways.

Dr. DeRose: It’s amazing, really is.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Now, some of our listeners might be wondering, well, you know, I know my particular health concerns and ailments, can Weimar really help me? Let’s say, I have high blood pressure or maybe I have heart disease, does this really work?

Dr. DeRose: It’s powerful, Jëan. These principles, this NEWSTART program, it comes from the first two chapters of the Bible when God created things in the beginning.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Alright.

Dr. DeRose: So it’s really getting back to God’s original plan for people. I have patients who had high blood pressure and heart disease in our last program there at Weimar. I think there’s one couple, they got off many of their medications and were feeling great. I mean one of them said, “I’ve got a new lease on life, I haven’t felt this good in years.” A lot of the medications, although they may seem necessary, they have side effects. And in this particular individual’s case, he was just a basket case from his medications. So the Lord’s healing program with God’s blessing and he’s a new man.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Amen. Well, for anyone wanting to know more about that, what is the website?

Dr. DeRose: It’s simply newstart.com.

Pastor Jëan Ross: And if you have a question related to health or the Bible, feel free to give us a call, 1-800-GOD-SAYS, that’s 1-800-463-7297. Our next caller is Brooke, and she is calling from Michigan. Brooke, welcome to the program.

Brooke: Thank you. My question is pertaining to first John 2, I think it’s verse 15, 16, somewhere around there. There are three things that are mentioned there: Pride of life, lust of the eyes and lust of the flesh. And what I’m wondering is what exactly specifically is the difference between those three?

Pastor Jëan Ross: Alright, let me read the verse. Actually, let me back up and we’ll start in verse--the verse you’re referring to is actually verse 16. But let me start in verse 15. John says, “Love not the world, neither things that are in the world. If any men love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.” And then he defines what the love of the world is, verse 16, he says, “For all that is in the world, is the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, it is not of the Father, but it’s of the world.” Now these three categories are the umbrellas for just about every sinful desire and propensity within the unconverted heart. For example, the lust of the flesh could relate to any unsanctified appetite or desire. That could be for food, that could be for sexuality, that could be for--I don’t know, Dr. DeRose, there’s probably all kinds of things that would fall into that category.

Dr. DeRose: Definitely. And it’s hard to draw a line as far as what these are, but to me it’s fascinating, too, as we speak about these three areas, Jesus was tempted in three areas…

Pastor Jëan Ross: That’s right.

Dr. DeRose: …in the wilderness. And if you look at them, there’s a parallel between these temptations and what Jesus went through on our behalf.

Pastor Jëan Ross: So, if you look at the first one, the lust of the flesh, that would fall into the first temptation that Jesus had which was turning stones to bread?

Dr. DeRose: I think most definitely. He was hunger and…

Pastor Jëan Ross: That was hunger, desire of the body, right?

Dr. DeRose: Exactly.

Pastor Jëan Ross: What about the second one? It says the lust of the eyes. That would be covetousness, which, of course, is the Tenth Commandment that says, “Thy shall not covet.” So seeing something that we want, that is out of harmony with God’s will, that would fall into that category. You know that particular area, I think, is exploited in our society through the mass media that we have today. People are constantly coveting things that they don’t need and that they can’t afford.

Dr. DeRose: That’s what marketing’s all about, isn’t it?

Pastor Jëan Ross: That’s right.

Dr. DeRose: Yeah, that’s an avenue, advertising.

Pastor Jëan Ross: So, which one of Christ’s temptations did He overcome when it relates to the lust of the eyes?

Dr. DeRose: Well, it’s an interesting, you know, question to ask, but really the last temptation where He would--I mean, there’s a blurring--and this word lust means deep desire. In fact, it’s not wrong to have deep desire. Jesus in Luke 22 said, “With desire I have desired to eat the last supper this passover.” But it’s what we do with that desire if it creeps in and, of course, Jesus wants to give us victory over it. That’s the big message of the wilderness experience, that Jesus concurred, and He gives that experience to us.

Pastor Jëan Ross: So the lust of the eyes for Christ would be, perhaps, when Satan showed all the kingdoms of this world and said, “You can have this. Just bow down and worship me.” And the pride of life that of course, would be selfishness; and Jesus was taken up to a pinnacle on the temple, and the devil said, “Throw yourself down; prove that you’re the Son of God.” That of course, would have been a prideful act on Christ’s part. So Jesus gained the victory in each of these three areas that every human being struggles with at some point in time, and Jesus gained the victory on our behalf, and He’s able to give us power.

Dr. DeRose: Amen.

Pastor Jëan Ross: You know, Brooke, we have a book that I think everyone will be able to appreciate and understand, it’s called “Tips for Resisting Temptation.” And I believe it even addresses this particular passage. To receive that book, call our resource line 1-800-835-6747, and you can ask for the book “Tips for Resisting Temptation,” and we’ll be happy to send that out. Thank you for your call. Our next caller is Adrian, and Adrian is calling from Oregon. Adrian, welcome to the program.

Adrian: Thanks. I was wondering how you explain God when He told the Israelites to destroy the nations in Canaan. How you would explain to someone why He killed every one in that nation, or He told them to destroy every one in those nations including even the babies that, you know, hadn’t--you know, that, you could say, what weren’t wicked yet?

Pastor Jëan Ross: Right, they hadn’t done anything wrong. That is a very good question. A lot of folks are puzzled about that. That almost falls into the category of why does God allow bad things to happen to good people? First of all, we need to recognize that God is love and He’s not willing that any should perish but that all should come to salvation. God gave the inhabitants of Canaan a four hundred plus years to come to some point of repentance towards God--remember you have Abraham, that travelled up and down Palestine, he was a wealthy man; God had blessed him with herds, with servants, and he was a witness to those heathen nations that he travelled through. And they knew about him, they knew about his beliefs, they knew about his God. For four hundred years, God had given them an opportunity to respond to what Abraham was saying and what the Holy Spirit was doing to their hearts. Finally, when the children of Israel came up out of Egypt and entered into the Promised Land, their time of probation had reached an end.

Now, why did God have the Israelites annihilate the entire nation, including their children? You know, the Bible does give us a principle when you read about this in the Ten Commandments, next to chapter 20, that says the inequity is passed on from to the third and fourth generation, that selfish propensity, that evil desire, is passed on mostly by example, from parent to child, and that continues down. Perhaps in some cases the children of these various pagan nations, if they grew up with Israel, they would lead them into apostasy, and God was trying to protect His people from error. There’s another thought to think about and that is: If these children, these babies had not yet reached the age of accountability, God being merciful, there is a chance that they could be in the resurrection and be taken to heaven and grow up not in a sin cursed environment like planet earth, but really in heaven, with the angels. You know, God knows the heart of every human being, and we have confidence that He is going to make the right decisions.

Dr. DeRose: You know, Jëan, one of the fascinating things about this and, Adrian, I think you might be interested in this, is we often from our human perspective we look and we say if someone dies or they’re killed, I mean, that’s the worst possible thing that could happen--and that’s true on this earth, death is an enemy--but God is always looking at eternity and so I appreciate, Jëan, your point, because there are examples in the Bible where people even in judgements had been destroyed. And it does not mean they were lost for eternity. I think of the disobedient prophet who gave a message to King Jeroboam, and in First Kings 14, another story that relates to Jeroboam, where the only righteous one in his household met an early end and it was to spare him something worse. So I think we have to keep this big focus in mind God is Love and we can trust Him even if we don’t understand.

Pastor Jëan Ross: You know, the beauty about the Bible, even these difficult questions that, from our perspective, seem hard or difficult to understand, there is ample evidence in the Bible of God’s great love and His compassion. And we can put our confidence in that, believing that God’s going to do the right thing. Does that make sense, Adrian?

Adrian: Yeah.

Pastor Jëan Ross: It’s still a challenging point from our perspective. But that’s why we need to trust in God’s goodness and love. Thanks for your call. Our next caller is Lenny and Lenny is calling from Michigan. Lenny, welcome to the program.

Lenny: Hello, thanks guys, for taking my call.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Sure.

Lenny: My question is regarding--I’m witnessing to an atheist and he loves to instead of dealing with the information he loves to just disregard it as far as, for example, there’s a lot of proof in the Bible just by prophecies and things that have happened that can be very convincing, but he will say something like, “Well, I don’t believe in God, so there’s no reason I believe the Bible.” And when we get into talks about Jesus, he will say things about the gospels where we’ll discuss well it doesn’t say that, so there’s obviously some back buzzing going on, it is when he tried to add something later because it was written at a later date, things like that. So, how would you go about convincing someone that, you know, all the gospels count even though they don’t all say the exact same thing?

Pastor Jëan Ross: That’s a good question. You know, I think the fact that we do have four gospels, and they do look at things from different perspectives, are they all harmonized with each other. But the different writers will emphasize different aspects of the life and ministry of Jesus. That gives us a more rounded picture of Christ’s ministry and His work. It also helps us to realize that the writers of the New Testament, in particular, the gospels, they didn’t all sit together in the same room at the same time and said, “Alright, well let’s come up with some stories,” but it was written over an extended period of time, and they didn’t copy from each other. They wrote and presented it from an eyewitness account from their own perspective. And the so-called contradictions that people will raise with reference to the gospels or any other passage of Scripture, if one takes a careful look at those various passages and compares them with the others, the so-called contradictions begin to vanish away, and you begin to understand a clearer picture of what’s being portrayed or shown.

Dr. DeRose: You now, one of the text that, for me, really helps in this whole dialogue is in Second Timothy chapter 3; verse 16, it gives us the reason why Scripture was given and it actually, in that--and I’ll read the text, it says, “All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, it’s profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness.” And why I read that is, it never says that the Bible is given to give my new details about how many fish were caught in a boat, or--and you know, Jëan, you may have thought about it this way, but a master photographer knows how to blur things in the picture that are unimportant and keep things sharp that need to be sharp. And so, some of these incidental details--I believe God knew that people would get overly preoccupied with them if He didn’t sometimes blur them, so if some things are little burry when you try to harmonize the gospels, that’s a detail that the Holy Spirit didn’t see fit to overrule and nail down because He didn’t want someone getting sidetracked.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Sidetracked or something. Sure.

Dr. DeRose: Right. He wants that focal message in the gospels that’s ironclad, it’s portrayed by Scripture, it’s fulfilled in the Old Testament and New, and it’s just anyone who’s willing to look honestly the Holy Spirit will carry them through.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Absolutely. You know, if you’re looking for reason to believe, the Bible has many of that. But if you’re looking for the occasional doubts, then you could probably find some things at least presented in a certain light that you can maybe use as reason not to believe. You know, we do have a resource talking about the Bible called the “Ultimate Resource,” and it deals with this very thing--what about the so called contradictions in Scripture, what do we do with them? We’d be happy to send that out to you, Lenny, if you would just call our resource line 1-800-835-6747, that’s 1-800-835-6747, ask for the book “The Ultimate Resource,” and we’ll be happy to put that in the mail.

You know, Dr. DeRose, there’s been many, many skeptics that have taken the Scriptures and said, “I’m going to read the Bible from cover to cover to prove that the Bible is a fairy tale, that God does not exist.” Now, what’s happened in many of those cases, they begin that task and they end up believing in the Bible, and believing in God. Of course, if one takes an honest look at the Scriptures, the evidence is overwhelming.

Dr. DeRose: Powerful.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Our next caller is LeRoy, and he is calling from Washington. LeRoy, welcome to the program.

LeRoy: Hello Pastors.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Yes, hi LeRoy, and your question?

LeRoy: My question is on the Bible itself.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Okay.

LeRoy: We have an old Bible that is falling apart, it’s not an expensive Bible, but we don’t know how to dispose of it. We’ve been told to burn it, which doesn’t sound right; throw them in the trash, that doesn’t sound right; so we’re wondering what do we do with it, how do we properly dispose of it?

Pastor Jëan Ross: That’s a good question. You know, we use our Bible, and it becomes such a part of our heart and our life, and then it comes time to get another one because this one’s falling apart, what do we do with the Bible? If you look in Scripture, there are some ways to deal with things that are sacred, things that are Holy. For example, in a number of churches, when you have leftover communion bread or grape juice, the appropriate way to dispose of that is either by burying it, or by burning it. Now, you know, it might not sound like burning the Bible seems like something you want to do, but that would be an appropriate means of getting rid of the Bible. We got to recognize that the Bible is ink and paper, what makes the Bible Holy and meaningful is the message conveyed in Scripture. You know, if you can find a way of disposing of the Bible in a, maybe, acceptable manner--I don’t know, Dr. DeRose, I know I have in the past actually burnt an old Bible that I didn’t need. But I don’t think that’s the case for everyone.

Dr. DeRose: Well, I think the parallel that you make, Jëan, is very appropriate because we’re treating the Bible with the utmost respect. It’s the word of God. And just like a loved one, who we lay to rest--I mean, this imagery of burying or burning, you know, is very similar. You treat the body of a loved one with respect. It’s the same with the Bible. And I think however God leads you to do that, I think there’s grounds, you know, burial, burning. I think, you know, in many traditions, those…

Pastor Jëan Ross: Would be appropriate.

Dr. DeRose: …would be appropriate, yeah.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Does that help, LeRoy?

LeRoy: Okay, thank you.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Alright, thanks for your call. We have Frank, who is listening from New York City. Frank, welcome to the program. Frank, are you there?

Frank: Yes. How are you?

Pastor Jëan Ross: Good, thank you. And your question?

Frank: My question is, there’s a certain denomination--I’m not going to mention--that say that Christ is the archangel Michael, where does this come from, and how do they come to this conclusion that Jesus is the archangel Michael?

Pastor Jëan Ross: Okay, good question. Well, let’s begin in Revelation chapter 12. I’ll give you a couple of verses if you just want to jot them down and then we can talk about them. In Revelation chapter 12, it speaks about Michael and his angels fighting against the dragon. And the dragon is Satan. And the dragon, he loses the fight, and he and his angels are cast out of heaven. So here we find Michael leading an angelic host in this battle against Lucifer and his angels. Then, if you go over to the book of Jude, which just precedes the Book of Revelation, he talks about Michael, the Archangel, when disputing with the body of Moses. So there we have Michael connected with archangel. Then if you go to the book of Second Thessalonians chapter 4, it speaks about the coming of Jesus, and it says…

Dr. DeRose: First Thessalonians.

Pastor Jëan Ross: …First Thessalonians, “The Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet of God and the dead in Christ will rise first.” Then if you go over to the gospels--and Dr. DeRose, maybe you can look this up for me--Jesus says, “The time is coming when all who were in their graves will hear His voice and shall come forth; those who have done good unto the resurrection of life, those who have done evil unto the resurrection of damnation.”

Dr. DeRose: John 5:28.

Pastor Jëan Ross: John 5:28. So, if you put all the pieces together, if it’s the voice of Jesus that raises the dead--and according to First Thessalonians chapter 4, it’s the voice of the archangel that raises the dead, and according to the Book of Jude, Michael is the Archangel, that would lead us to conclude then that Michael is the prophetic name of Jesus. Now, having said that--I just want to clarify--we are not saying that Jesus is an angel. And that’s sometimes a misunderstanding because of the word. The word “archangel” in the Greek means the ruler of the angels, or the one who is above the angels, just like an ark is above something, the ruler of the angels, the one who is above the angels, or the commander of the angels, the General of the angels is referred to as Michael. We don’t believe that Jesus, by any means, is an angel. He is not a created being, He is the creator and yet He is the ruler of the angels, He is the one in charge of the angels.

Dr. DeRose: Two other very interesting lines of thought to consider. One is the Hebrew name Michael, it literally means “Who is like God.” And many have suggested that Jesus, from the beginning, was stepping down to reveal the glory of God to His created being. So, just like He came as a man, some have wondered, “Did Jesus, to the angels, come on as the chief above the angels? Did he come, in some sense, as an angel? Was it possible that some even mistook Him for an angel?” And there’s some foundation for this in the Bible. If you look at Gideon’s story in Judges 6, you’ll see that in one hand, it speaks about an angel, and then they say, “Well, we’ve seen God.”

Pastor Jëan Ross: Yeah, the experience of Jacob wrestling with the angel, and then he says, “Well, I have seen God.”

Dr. DeRose: Exactly.

Pastor Jëan Ross: So in the Old Testament sometimes Christ is referred to as the Angel of the Lord. Now, let me add one more thing about that. In the Greek, the word angel is Angelos, it means messenger. Not always is it a being as we think of an angel today, but it could be a messenger. For example, in Revelation chapter 14, you have these three angels flying in the midst of heaven, proclaiming God’s last warning message to the world. Primarily, those angels refer to God’s people proclaiming His last message of warning to the world. So, an angel is not always, in Scripture, as we might think of an angel today. Michael, then, being a prophetic name of Christ--let me give you one other verse, if you go to Daniel chapter 12, the 1st verse, it says, “And at that time Michael shall stand up, the great prince who stands for the children of thy people.” So here, Michael is referred to as the prince who stands for Daniels’ people. That, of course, would refer to Jesus.

Frank: But it doesn’t actually mean that Michael is Jesus, because I don’t think God would send an angel to die in His place.

Pastor Jëan Ross: No.

Dr. DeRose: No, he wasn’t an angel.

Pastor Jëan Ross: No, let me just reaffirm that. When you use the word archangel, you’re not saying that Michael is an angel; you’re saying that he is the ruler of the angels, he is the one in charge of the angels. He’s the General of the angels. But Christ is not an angel.

Frank: Alright. The angel of the Lord in the Old Testament is actually Christ, am I right or wrong?

Pastor Jëan Ross: That’s correct--not always, but many times it refers to the Angel of the Lord, it could be Christ. You got to read the context. For example, Jacob wrestles with the angel. It’s actually Christ.

Frank: Right.

Pastor Jëan Ross: You know, we have a book, believe it or not, on this subject too. It’s called “Michael the Archangel.” And it goes into detail with all the verses that I gave you, and some other evidence in Scripture that helps one understand who Michael is. It’s a fascinating subject. Frank, if you would call that resource line, it’s 1-800-835-6747 and if you would ask for the book, “Michael the Archangel,” or “Who is Michael,” we will be happy to send that out to you. Well, we have probably time for one more call, and we’re going to try and squeeze this one in. And we have Jill, who is calling from New York, or Gill. Gill, welcome to the program.

Gill: Yes, hi, good evening. I’m also blind, I’m not able to see and also suffering from ringing in the ears for a long time, and so I got saved. I wish I had time to share, but I know the Bible says in Psalm 119; verse 71, “It is good for me that I have been afflicted; that I might learn your decrees.” I was just wondering if the Doctor has any kind of solution because, you know, doctors just say, “You got to learn to live with it,” or so many other things. I wish I had time to tell you here.

Dr. DeRose: Right. Well, tinnitus, of course, is condition of ringing in the ears. It often goes along with hearing loss. And many times people don’t feel they are aware of hearing loss but there is some component of that in most cases of tinnitus. Very interesting, research that’s looked at lifestyle and hearing, and there is some evidence that really an excellent diet like God gave mankind in Genesis 1; verse 29 actually can help many problems that relate to circulation. That original diet is a totally plant-based diet, beans, seeds, nuts, fruits, vegetables. If microcirculation, the circulation in the small blood vessels can be improved, there’s some evidence, can improve hearing and it may even help with tinnitus. I had a patient just in our last NEWSTART program at Weimar who was having tinnitus constantly. During the course of our program, it went away during the day; she was still having some problem with it at night.

Pastor Jëan Ross: So there is help.

Gill: What I do not know is basically I had clubbed before I was saved, and it’s been around--so I don’t know if it’s just a nutritional problem, but I certainly believe in holistic treatment.

Dr. DeRose: Amen. I know the Lord can bless that as well as other things to help with that.

Gill: Thank you.

Dr. DeRose: You’re welcome.

Gill: You have a great night, guys.

Dr. DeRose: Hey, thanks so much.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Thanks for your call. We’re going to try one more quick caller. Do we have time? Let’s try. We’ve got Russell calling from New York, listening on WBAJ. Russell, your question?

Russell: Yes. Good evening. And happy sailing out in Hawaii. But I have a question of…

Pastor Jëan Ross: I’ll tell you what, Russell, we have less than a minute to go. I hear the music playing in the background, so…

Russell: Alright, so in the Book of Exodus, it says for us to not to go out there and murder people…

Pastor Jëan Ross: Yes.

Russell: …and stuff.

Pastor Jëan Ross: Yes.

Russell: But in the Book of Genesis, it also says that Cain killed Abel--yeah, killed Abel and there’s a lot of confusing…

Pastor Jëan Ross: Alright, let me jump in here, Russell. I know we’ve got less than thirty seconds. Let me give you a quick answer. In the commandment where it says, “Thy shall not kill,” the actual there in the Hebrew is, “Thy shall not murder.” And we see that happening in the story of Cain and Abel. Cain did murder his brother Abel. Well, friends, I’m sorry, we’ve run out of time. Please join us again next week for another program. God bless you.


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