The Quest for Eternal Freedom (2018)

The Quest for Eternal Freedom (2018)

Date: 05/05/2019 
Have you ever wondered why Jesus asked, 'Why do you call me good?', or what kind of transportation we'll have in Heaven ? Have you ever thought about the requirements for eternal life, or when it is that our spirit goes to Heaven after we die ? Did God abandon Jesus at the cross or did Jesus ever lose faith ? Tune in and study with us to learn more about these topics and many others in this installment of Bible Answers Live with Pastor Doug and Pastor Ross.
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Doug Batchelor: Hello listening friends, would you like to hear an amazing fact? In November 1939, a young Polish Lieutenant, Slavomir Rawicz, was arrested by the Russians following the German-Soviet invasion of Poland. Following 12 months of interrogation, he was sentenced to 25 years hard labor for a bogus charge of spying and sent off to Siberia. With thousands of others, Słav was transported in an open cattle truck in sub-zero temperatures.

To the end of the line at Irkutsk, at that point, the wretched prisoners were chained together and forced to march hundreds of miles to Camp 303, which the survivors then had to build for themselves from scratch. In April 1941, with the aid of the camp commandant's wife, Slav and six others escaped in a blizzard. For the next year, they trekked 4,000 miles, living off the land, through the Gobi desert, and over the Himalayas, on through Tibet, until they reached India, where they were discovered by some Gurkha patrols.

Three of the seven died on the way. When rescued, Slav weighed only 70 pounds, but he went on to live to the age of 88. Through sheer determination, he and three others had survived bitter, cold, suffocating heat, thirst, starvation and major injury in their epic quest for freedom. Did you know that the central message of the Bible is about a pilgrimage to freedom? Stay with us, friends, we're going to learn more on this edition of Bible Answers Live.

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Speaker 1: You're listening to Bible Answers Live. Honest answers to your Bible questions. This broadcast is a previously recorded episode. To receive any of the Bible resources mentioned in this evening's program, call 800-835-6747. Once again, that's 800-835-6747. Now, let's Join our host, Pastor Doug Batchelor, and our co-host, Pastor Jean Ross.

Doug: Welcome listening friends to Bible Answers Live and we invite you to call with your Bible questions. This is, in my opinion, the best use of radio technology, to call in and talk about the Word of God. That's what changes hearts and that's the only thing that's going to last forever, is people transformed by the gospel. If you have any questions about living the Christian life or about the Word of God in the Bible, that's what we're about. We don't talk much about finance or romance, but we will talk about Jesus. My name is Doug Batchelor.

Jean Ross: My name is Jean Ross. Good evening listening friends. We want to welcome you all to, again, Bible Answers Live. Our Facebook friends who are joining us, we also want to greet you, thank you for tuning in. Pastor Doug, I think's probably a good time to start the program with prayer. Dear Father in heaven, we thank you once again, that we have this opportunity to study you word. We’re just going to ask for your continued guidance as we search the scriptures. Be with those listening. We ask this in Jesus’ name. Amen.

Doug: Amen.

Ross: Now, Pastor Doug, you opened the program with telling this rather remarkable story of endurance and just undying determination for freedom, traveling more than 4,000 miles on foot through the terrible terrain, trying to find freedom.

Doug: That is some of the most desolate country on the planet. If you look at the map, and then you can find a map online of where they walk. Walking across Siberia, then they ran into a big lake, one of the biggest lakes in the world. They had to go hundreds of miles around this lake and then through the Gobi Desert, and through the high ranges of Tibet. It's amazing that, Slavomir, was able to help them.

He had learned how to trap when he was young. He helped them trap and fish, and they just lived on a pretty meager diet, but they were so determined to be free, that they avoided revealing themselves to anybody until they got all the way to India where they knew that they might find some English that would sympathize. It's just an amazing story. It makes me think about in the Bible, where it tells us that the message of scripture is one of a people that are searching for freedom.

The whole message of the Exodus is people leaving their bondage, their slavery there, and going to the Promised Land, a place of freedom. You've got so many stories of people like Joseph, who go from the prison to the palace, and Peter saved from prison, and Paul saved from prison, and Daniel saved from the lions’ den. This is a message of what God also wants to do for us. Friends, if you'd like to know more about how you can experience that freedom, we've got a very special book that even talks about Siberia.

Ross: It is a book entitled, Deathwatch in Siberia. It's really talking about just the good news of salvation and the experience that God sustained those who chose Him, how God sustained them through some difficult trials. It's a great read. Great book.

Doug: It's a great testimony.

Ross: Again, called Deathwatch in Siberia. For anybody who would like to receive that, give us a call on our resource phone line and we'll be happy to send that to you. The number is 800-835-6747. You can ask for our free offer tonight, which is, Deathwatch in Siberia. All right Pastor Doug, I think that we're ready to go to the phone lines. Our first caller this evening is Ken, listening in Wisconsin. Ken, welcome to the program.

Ken: Hi, Pastor Ross and Pastor Doug. I had a question on Mark 10:18.

Doug: Okay.

Ken: Jesus say, "Why do you call me good? No one is good, except God alone." I'm a little bit confused.

Doug: You think, does that mean Jesus wasn't good? Well, first of all, the Bible says, "Every good and perfect gift is from God," and Jesus was God the Son, and he was good. He is God's gift as well. Jesus was not saying, "I'm not good." He was trying to help the young men see that He is God, because Jesus said, "You're calling me good? All men have fallen and sinned, but maybe the only reason that I could be good is if I'm from the Father. I am God." God the Son. He wasn't denying his goodness, he was trying to impress the young man with his godness. Do you see what I'm saying?

Ken: I guess, yes.

Doug: Well, do you think Jesus was good?

Ken: Yes, He is good.

Doug: Yes. This young man, he's looking for eternal life and he said, "Why do you call me good? There's no one good except God." He's basically saying, "I was there in the beginning. I'm the one who declared all things good at creation." Now, doesn't the Bible say that all things that were made were made by Jesus? In the beginning, was the Word and then God, when He created everything, declared it good. God is good, the Bible says. Jesus wasn't denying that he was good, he was just trying to help that young man recognize that he wasn't just a good master. He calls him good teacher, he was more than a teacher. He was God.

I have a free book, I can send you on that subject. Talks about the divinity of Christ, and it's called, The Trinity. Is it biblical? If you'd like a free copy of that, we'll send that to you.

Ross: The number to call is 800-835-6747, and again, you can ask for the book called The Trinity. Is it biblical? We'll be happy to send that out to anybody who calls and asks. Our next call is, Michael, listening from Mississippi. Michael, welcome to the program.

Michael: Hi.

Doug: Hi.

Michael: Hi, Doug. Well, my question is, I wonder what kind of transportation is going to be in heaven? Is it going to be like-- I know there is a lot of people that loves cars in Earth today. What about in heaven, will there be any kind of transportation, like cars or the new Earth's cars?

Doug: Well, I'll tell you, Pastor Ross and I were just talking about racecars before we went on the air. It's a special love of his. I think that we're going to be able to build all kinds of creative things. God made man to create. We probably will not have cars that are burning fossil fuels in heaven [laughs] but I'll tell you, what it does say, when an angel came to Daniel, it says, "Being caused to fly swiftly." Angels fly. We see in Revelation, "I saw an angel flying in the midst of heaven." Then you read in Isaiah that, "The redeemed of the Lord, will mount up with wings like eagles."

For that reason and others, were given the belief that in heaven, we're going to be able to fly. I think we're going to be using wings, like birds, necessarily, but there's something that God gives us, that gives us the ability to be transported. Now, it says we're going to plant gardens and eat the fruit of them. We'll build houses. If we're building houses and we say, "Look, I want to build a heavenly motorcycle." I don't think God's can tell you, you can't, but it's going to probably be pretty different than what you might imagine now. Paul says, "You can't imagine the things God's prepared for those that love Him."

Michael: Yes.

Doug: I'll make you a promise. You're not going to be disappointed. You get there and I promise you, you won't be disappointed.

Michael: Oh, okay.

Doug: If you are, I'll give you your money back.

Michael: [laughs] Okay.

Doug: All right.

Ross: We do have a study guide talking about heaven, it's called, Colossal City in Space, and it talks about what God is preparing for those that love Him. We'll be happy to send this to anybody who asks for it. The number is 800-835-6747. You can also ask if you'd like, to sign up for the free correspondence Bible school that Amazing Facts has, or just ask for the lesson called, A Colossal City in Space.

Doug: Amen.

Ross: I'll be happy to send it to anybody who calls and asks.

Speaker 4: Did you know Amazing Facts has a free Bible school that you can do from the comfort of your own home? It includes 27 beautifully illustrated study lessons to aid in your study of God's word. Sign up today for this free Bible study course by calling 1-844-215-7000. That's 1-844-215-7000.

Ross: Our next caller is Archie listening from California. Arch, welcome to the program.

Archie: Hi, pastors. We appreciate your ministry. My question is everyone would like to live forever if it will not be like it is now, but is to believe and trust, and obey God enough. In other words, what exactly is necessary now for us to live in heaven forever?

Doug: What is necessary for us to have eternal life. Christ tells us that if we come to him, if we deny ourselves, take up our cross and follow him, trust him with our lives, trust him to forgive our sins. Of course, first thing is you accept him as savior, you tell him that you're sorry for your sins, you confess and repent of your sins, He says He'll give us the spirit and the power to turn from our sins because we can't do anything without Jesus, without him we can do nothing.

He promises that by faith when we first accept him, he offers us the gift of everlasting life. We, through accepting him, become citizens of another kingdom, and heaven then becomes our home. He says, "I've gone to prepare a place for you, and if I've gone to prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you unto myself." That's John 14. We do have a book that goes through what is necessary for eternal life, we'll send you for free. It's simply called Three Steps to Heaven, Archie. If you call the number, we'll send it to you right now or anybody.

Ross: The number to call is 800-835-6747. Probably, the most important question anyone can ask, "What do I have to do to be saved?" Well, the book will clearly show you from the Bible, it's called Three Steps to Heaven. I'd like to encourage you to call and ask for it. The number is 800-835-6747 or you can read it for free online at the Amazing Facts website, just amazingfacts.org. Next caller is Lewis listening from I think it's Connecticut. Lewis, welcome to the program.

Lewis: Greetings, pastors. First-time caller, longtime listener. Thank you for your ministry.

Doug: Well, thank you.

Lewis: Thank you, sir. Now my question comes from Jude 1:9. Pastors, you've taught in the past that Michael is Jesus, correct?

Doug: Yes.

Lewis: If he's Jesus, why would he have to call upon the Lord to rebuke Satan?

Doug: Jesus several times even during his earthly ministry, he willingly took a role of submission to the father. The Bible tells us that the father has committed all judgment to the son. The Bible says that the father through the son created the world, and Jesus often invokes the ultimate authority of God the father. He's even saying really in his own name as well. You remember in the wilderness when Jesus was being tempted by the devil? He rebuked the devil. The last temptation, he said, "Get thee behind me," and Satan had to go.

Just so nobody misunderstands. By the way, this is not like our pit belief or anything. Many of the Bible reformers, they looked at the Christophanies. There's a number of places in the Old Testament where this angel of the Lord, with great authority, would appear, and they would say, "I just preached on Samson this week," and his parents said, "We've seen God," when they saw the angel of the Lord. When Joshua saw the angel of the Lord, the angel said, "Take your shoes off your feet for you are on holy ground.” Well, that's what God said to Moses. Then it tells us that when Michael stands up, a resurrection takes place, in Daniel 12.

You start looking at the authority of Michael. You've got the dragon in Revelation as a symbol for the chief of evil, which is the devil, Michael is a symbol for the chief of good which would be Christ. Many of the great reformers believe that Jesus is not an angel. Archangel means greatest messenger. Jesus, he's not a cherub or a seraphim, but Michael means who is as God, and he is the greatest messenger, and the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a shout and the voice of the archangel. That's one sentence. The lord himself with the voice of the archangel. The lord is coming with the voice of the greatest messenger.

Lewis: Fantastic.

Doug: I've got a free book I'll send you on that. It simply says, Who is Michael the Archangel.

Lewis: All right, great. Thank you.

Doug: Thank you.

Ross: The number to call for that is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the book called Who is Michael the Archangel. One more time, 800-835-6747. If you have a Bible question, our phone line here to the studio is 800-463-7297. If you happen to get a busy signal, we encourage you to call back again or just stay on the line and somebody will get to your call.

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Speaker 1: You're listening to Bible answers live. This broadcast is a previously recorded episode. If you'd like answers to your Bible-related questions on the air, please call us next Sunday between 7:00 PM and 8:00 PM Pacific time. Call us at 1-800-GOD-SAYS.

Ross: Our next caller is Jose listening in California. Jose, welcome to the program.

Jose: Hi, pastors. Thank you so much for taking my call.

Doug: Well, thank you for your patience.

Jose: Yes, thank you. My question is should I be concerned with my congregation preaching end-time prophecies?

Doug: What's wrong with preaching end-time prophecy?

Jose: My concern is that they're not preaching it.

Doug: Oh you said they're not preaching it?

Jose: Yes. Should I look for another church to go to because we are so involved with what we hear from all your messages and other pastors who agree with preaching the end-time message? The question is should we look for another place to fellowship in as far as preaching truth.

Doug: Of course, a pastor should be preaching the entire word of God. I preached on Samson this week, you don't always preach on the end-time message, but you don't also want to be neglecting one of the great-- Here we are living on the end of time and if a church is never saying anything about the times in which we live, that is not healthy either. You can't only preach on end-time prophecy or people don't get a balanced diet.

I would talk to the pastors in a loving way and maybe write a note and say, "We would love to hear some messages on all the prophecies. It was important to Jesus. There's a blessing pronounced on those who read the book of Revelation." Just encourage them. You may need to shop around if people are neglecting big sections of God's word. Does that make sense?

Jose: Yes, I absolutely agree pastor. Yes, it definitely does. We'll definitely keep them in prayer just so that-- I definitely agree with what you're saying.

Doug: All right. We appreciate that very much. Trying to think what we can send him on prophecy yet?

Ross: Yes, we do have a number of things of prophecy. I'm thinking probably one of the most important subjects that you can talk about Bible prophecy is the three angels messages found in Revelation 14. We do have a study guide dedicated to that, and it's called Angel Messages from Space. An intriguing name there, but that's talking about the three angels messages. We'll be happy to send that to anybody who calls and asks. Again, the study guide is called Angel Messages from Space. We'll be happy to send that to anyone who calls 800-835-6747. That number again is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the study guide called Angel Messages from Space.

By the way, if you don't call the number but you'd like to read the study guide for free online, just go to the Amazing Facts website. It's just amazingfacts.org, and you'll be able to read it there as well as a number of other important resources that we have that I think you'll thoroughly enjoy. One more time, if you've got your pen handy, the number to call is 800-835-6747, and you can ask for the study guide called Angel Messages from Space. Our next caller that we have is Ben listening in Washington. Ben, welcome to the program.

Ben: Hello.

Doug: Hi, Ben, welcome.

Ben: My question is when Nadab and Abihu took unholy fire into the sanctuary, it says that fire came out from the presence of the Lord and devoured them. Then later in the text it says that they had men come in to carry them out. My question is were Nadab and Abihu ashes at that point when they carried them out or?

Ross: That's a good question. Firstly, it relates to-- You remember the story where God had given very clear and strict instructions through Moses, as to the priests, Aaron and his sons, as to what they were to do. They were to use special consecrated fire when they entered into the first compartment of the sanctuary, that's where they would offer the incense. They were also involved in just setting aside the sacredness of the sanctuary and a judgment came, which was a lesson to all of Israel. The Shekinah Glory or the visible presence of God was manifest in the Most Holy place.

Most likely what happened, of course, we weren't there, but probably there was a flash of light, possibly heat, but the two were struck down. Not so much that they were consumed completely with fire, but it was sufficient heat or flame that took their life. They fell to the ground. Now, this is in the first compartment of the sanctuary. There were other priests that could enter in and remove the body from where it was. All of that was really just a testimony or a witness that the work of God is sacred and that there is a high responsibility.

Ben: Can I ask you another question?

Ross: Sure.

Ben: In Revelation, when the fire comes down from God out of the Holy City, Jerusalem, do you think that the same thing happens to the wicked that are attacking the city? They may be knocked out and then turned to ashes after they die?

Doug: Eventually it tells us fire comes down from God out of heaven and devours them. At some point, the fire does ultimately devour them and how long each person suffers, may vary. The Bible says every man is rewarded according to what he deserves. We do have a lesson that talks about the punishment of the wicked. We'll be happy to send you a copy. I wonder if we can send out that new magazine we have talking about the mystery of death, hell, and everlasting life.

Ross: A brand new magazine that Amazing Facts has just put together. I think you can order it online if you'd like to purchase one, but you can call and ask for it. I'm sure we'll be able to send you one. The number to call is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the magazine entitled The Afterlife Mystery, and it deals with the subject of death. We also have a study guide that's entitled Are The Dead Really Dead? You can ask for that. We'll be happy to send that out to anybody who calls and asks. Next one we have is Rick listening in New Jersey. Rick, welcome to the program.

Rick: Hi, pastors, how are you doing?

Doug: Doing great, thank you for calling.

Rick: The question I have may not have a definite answer, maybe only speculation, but we know that Stephen was the first martyr and as he was being stoned to death, he looked up into heaven and he saw Jesus standing at the right hand of God. I don't know the Bible verses, but verbatim, I'm a truck driver, but I don't have access right now, but isn't Jesus referred to as sitting at the right hand of God in other parts of scripture and here he's standing at the right hand of God. Was that because maybe he's taking notice of maybe he's got Jesus' attention and I'm thinking maybe he's getting ready to walk with Jesus into the kingdom, or?

Doug: Let me read that, that Acts 7, and I think you read in verse 59, “And as they were stoning Steve, and he called out, ‘Lord Jesus receive my spirit’.” Wait a second. It's they're standing at the right hand of God. He saw the son of man standing at the right hand of God, and that's verse 56. That is interesting because it's like the Lord was looking out for him.

Rick: Maybe he's got my full attention.

Ross: Absolutely, but I think there's a little more to that too. You'll find in Daniel 12, just bear with me for a second. Daniel 12 talks about Michael, says when Michael stands up, there'll be a time of trouble. That's when probation closes for the human race. Michael is the prophetic name of Christ. Something significant happened when Stephen was stoned. That was the fulfillment of the 490-year prophecy that you find in Daniel 9.

In a very real sense, probation was closing for the Jewish nation, and that's of course at that point where you have the conversion of Saul who becomes Paul, and he's known as the apostle to the Gentiles. The gospel then spread out to the whole world. Some have seen in the fact that Jesus was standing at that very moment, not only concerned about what was happening to Steven, but it also signified a close of probation for the nation of Israel as a whole in the revelation of Christ.

Doug: Of course, we believe that God's got a special work for Jewish people and that Jews can be saved. It doesn't mean that, but their purpose was to declare and proclaim the Messiah. When Stephen gave that last message and the Supreme Court plugged their ears, it fulfilled the prophecy that they were going to be conquered and they were at that point, not too long after that. We have a lesson that talks about that. Don't we? Dealing with the time of the judgment? What is that, right on time?

Ross: Right on time. Yes.

Doug: It talks about the date for the judgment. God Sets The Date For The Judgment. I’m sorry.

Ross: That’s the one, okay.

Doug: God Sets The Date For The Judgment.

Ross: If you'd like to receive that, Rick or anybody, the number to call is 800-835-6747. We'll be happy to send that to anybody who calls and asks, it's called God Set A Date For The Judgment. Our next caller that we have is Jade listening in Michigan. Jade, welcome into the program.

Jade: Hey, good evening.

Doug: Hey, Jade, let's get started on your question. If we come up to the break, we'll finish it after the break. Okay?

Jade: Okay, great. We've been going through the book of Mark here in and we got to this point in chapter 5, verse 25 about the woman with the issue of 12 years. Then down at the end of the chapter, there's a young girl here that has been healed, and she was 12 years old. The question was asked; is there some things symbolic about this lady with the issue in this girl that's 12 years old healed also?

Doug: I am so glad you asked that question. That is very perceptive and I've got a very exciting answer for you on that.

Jade: I can't wait.

Doug: You can't wait, but you're going to have to wait until after our break. We got a break coming up, I don't even want to start on it because I think the break comes up in 30 seconds or about that. It is interesting that you get these two women. In the middle of Christ’s ministry, within a few minutes of each other, they both touched Jesus or he touches them. They're both connected with 12 years. 12 is a number that signifies the church. When we come back after the break, I'm going to explain how that all ties together. It is a fascinating study.

Don't go anywhere, friends. We're going to be back. If you have questions, give us a call, 800-GOD-SAYS, and we're back online for our Facebook friends at the Doug Batchelor Facebook site. Talk to you in just a moment.

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Speaker 1: Stay tuned. Bible Answers Live will return in a moment.

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Speaker 1: Every Bible question you have answered moves you one step closer to the fullness of God's will for your life. What are you waiting for? Get the answers you need for a fuller, richer, more confident life. You're listening to Bible Answers Live. This broadcast is a previously recorded episode. If you'd like answers to your Bible-related questions on the air, please call us next Sunday between 7:00 PM and 8:00 PM Pacific time. To receive any of the Bible resources mentioned in this evening's program call 800-835-6747. Once again, that's 800-835-6747. Now let's join pastors, Doug Batchelor and Jean Ross for more Bible Answers Live.

Ross: Hello friends. Yes, you all listening To Bible Answers Live, and our phone lines are open. If you have a Bible related question, as you heard there in the break, give us a call. We'd like to hear from you. The number is 800-463-7297. Pastor Doug, just before the break, we were talking to Jade and he was talking about Mark 5.

Doug: Yes, this is an incredible story where you have Jesus is on his way through the small town. He stopped by a man named Jarius who says, “My daughter's at the point of death, and will you come heal her?” Jesus is going to raise or to heal this young man's daughter. While he is going, he's just mobbed with people on every side. This one woman who has been bleeding for 12 years, which would render her unclean in the Bible, she has faith that if she could just touch the hem of his garment, she'll be healed.

There’s another place I read in the Bible where it says many believers, if they could just touch the hem of his clothes, they'd be healed. She was one of them. Jesus stops and says, “Who touched me?” She tells the whole story. Then he goes from that experience and he touches this girl who has, by this point died. She's 12 years old. He raises her life. It's telling us, I believe in Bible symbols, a woman represents a church. Here, you have Christ, who is the central axis of the Old Testament and New Testament churches.

The Old Testament, there was a continual flow of blood of animals, but they didn't get any better, and they weren't saved by the blood of animals until they touched Jesus, the cross, when Jesus bled for them. Then you've got this little girl who looks like she's dead. When Christ died, they thought the church was done for, but he resurrects her. At the resurrection, the church was brought back to life and she's 12 years old. 12 is a number for the church.

You got a woman in Revelation 12, with 12 crowns, 12 stars, rather, above her head and you got the 12 tribes, and the 12 judges, and the 12 apostles, and the New Jerusalem has 12,000 Furlongs. 12 is a number for the church. This is a wonderful story in the middle of the gospel, it’s talking about how the Old Testament they were saved by looking forward and faith to Christ. The New Testament are saved by looking back to Christ. Those two women represent Ruth and Naomi, the old and the new that both nursed Obed and it's just a wonderful story. Did that make some sense?

Jade: Oh yes, great. I can use that. I just want you guys to know that we really appreciate you here in Michigan.

Doug: Thank you. Hey y'all, I'll be at the Michigan camp meeting at the Great Lakes Academy this summer. I think Pastor Ross is there too. We'll look forward to seeing you.

Jade: Yes, that'd be great.

Doug: Hi, God bless you, jade.

Jade: See you then.

Ross: Bye-bye. Next caller that we have, I believe he's, Larry listening in Tennessee.

Laurie: Yes, it's Laurie.

Ross: Laurie, hi, Laurie. Welcome.

Laurie: Hi, my question is will the church be drafted out mid-tribulation and could that be any day.

Doug: Well, there are a lot of dear Christians that are on all three parts of the timing. I want to just make that really clear. Some Christians believe that the second coming the Christians are caught up before the tribulation. Some believe it's after three-and-a-half years in the middle of the tribulation and some believe the tribulation comes before we are caught up. I am of the group that believes that the tribulation comes before and the reason is Jesus says he that endures to the end will be saved. Paul said it is through tribulation we enter the kingdom of God.

You can also see in the Bible that God saved the children of Israel. Well, the seven last plagues you see in Revelation, they are the great tribulation. It’s pretty clear that that's when everything's falling apart. Then you also have the children of Israel were in Egypt when the 10 plagues fell on Egypt. That's interesting that they were protected from the seven last plagues, which are similar to the seven plagues you find in Revelation. We believe that tribulation comes first and then it says at that time, Daniel 12, there'll be a great time of trouble such as there never has been, and at that time that people will be delivered.

Everyone found written in the book and many of those that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake. Well, that's when the Lord descends from heaven with a shout, the dead in Christ rise. Then that was 1st Thessalonians 4. I do have a book, I can send you a free copy on that, Laurie, that's called Anything But Secret, that talks about the timing of the tribulation connected with the second coming and being caught up to meet the Lord. You’re there?

Laurie: Yes, that would be great.

Doug: Ask for the book, Anything But Secret, we'll send you a free copy. You just got to call this one number.

Ross: Yes. The number to call is 800-835-6747, and you can ask for the book called Anything But Secret. That number once again is 800-835-6747. Our next caller, calling from Texas, Rowel. Rowel, welcome to the program.

Rowel: Hey, how's it going?

Doug: Good. Thanks for calling.

Rowel: Thanks for doing this.

Doug: Your question tonight.

Rowel: My question is what's the best way to go about when you're reading the Bible to know if what's being written is specifically to the people of that time, or if it's something that is a cultural thing, or if it's something that we actually need to apply to our lives.

Doug: Good question. Of course, everything should be read in its context, but all of the Bible is written for everybody to learn from. For instance, when Noah told people, “Get on the arc, a flood is coming.” Well, we learned from that about the last days, Jesus said it will be like the days of Noah. Now, you and I are not supposed to build a boat and get on it. That was a specific message that was present truth for them but we do definitely learn from that lesson. There's a number of things in the Bible that were specific messages to a specific time but we all learn from there's lessons in those histories and in those statements.

Now, you asked another question, are some things cultural? Yes, there are. One of the common questions we get is regarding 1st Corinthians where it says, it's a shame for a woman to pray with her head uncovered. There's only one verse that says that, but we get a lot of questions. Well, is it wrong for a woman to have short hair? Or must a woman always wear a head covering or a hat, or a bonnet in church? You probably know, as we do, there are many sincere Christians that do wear, the women all wear hats.

I frankly think that was a cultural custom. I have no problem with a person believing differently. There's certainly no harm in it because you don't find the scripture mentioned in more than one spot. You think Paul is really talking to the Corinthian church there, so that would be more of a cultural thing, but he's got great lessons in there about headship. Talks about God being the head of every man. The lessons are still there even when there's a cultural message or tradition. You’re still with me?

Rowel: Yes, I'm here.

Doug: Is that making sense?

Rowel: Yes, it makes sense. It's just that-

Doug: Is there a specific place you're wondering about where you're wondering, is this a tradition or is this for all of us?

Rowel: There's just like specific topics that have popped up in my mind. It just makes things uncertain, unclear about other things.

Doug: Well, there are some things that were cultural, some commandments are very explicit in the Bible and God's word doesn't change in that respect. Whenever you're in doubt, do the safe thing. If you've got doubts, Bible says anything not of faith is sin, do the safe thing and follow your convictions, follow the word of God, and then you'll just tell the Lord when he comes, “Look, Lord set it right here so I did it,” and you have no problem. Thank you for your call. We appreciate that very much, Rowel.

[music]

Speaker 8: Written by the hand of God and spoken with his voice, some words will never fade.

[music]

Speaker 1: Get Pastor Doug Batchelor's 12-part sermon series on the 10 commandments by calling 800-538-7275 or visit AFbookstore.com.

Ross: Next one of them we have is Malora listening from Virginia. Malora, welcome to the program.

Malora: Hi.

Doug: Hi.

Malora: I was wondering, when is it appropriate to censure a church member? What behaviors warrant such a measure?

Doug: Well, there can be a spectrum of things and different churches, of course, in different denominations have different policies in our church. There may be a person who's had a moral fall and you don't want them to stop coming, but they're really not in a position to be holding office. Some churches will say, “Look, if a couple’s going through a divorce, one of them might have biblical grounds, one may not. Probably not a good time for them to be holding a public position in the church because it just-- they, first of all, don't need that.”

If a person is creating division in a church through all kinds of gossip and contentious behavior, Paul says, don't bear with those people. At some point, you need to warn them with censure and they might need to be eventually put out of the church. Then, of course, there's gross sins. If a person who's living in some high handed sin, 1st Corinthians, I forget what the verse is, Pastor Ross, where that man was living with his stepmother, evidently. Paul said, “What's wrong with you?”, telling the Corinthian church, “You need to kick him out.” He was becoming a-- The culture, the pagans were making fun of the Christians. They said, "Look at what they're doing and they don't stand for anything." That gives a bad name to the church. There's a pretty broad list, I could start listing all kinds of sins here but that's just some examples. Things that would really be bringing reproach on the Lord, or an open violation to one of the commandments. That doesn't mean [crosstalk]

Malora: By bringing reproach on the Lord.

Doug: Yes, if someone is doing something that is bringing reproach on the name of the Lord, then they might need-- Now, censure is different than being disfellowshipped. Censure is a probation and a warning. You're wanting to redeem them, you're not kicking them out of the church but you're saying, "Until you get this cleaned up or little time needs to go by before we put you back into some position of visibility." That's typically the way censure is used, but it rarely happens. Do you mind my asking why you're asking?

Malora: We're having this division in our church over one man doesn't like the pastor, and the pastor doesn't like him. I think the pastor is using his position to make things more difficult for the parishioner and it's just awful. I mean--

Doug: Yes. That's the devil tries to bring in division and sometimes-- I'm a pastor and I think there are pastors that have abused their authority, but I think there’re times as a pastor needs to say, "If you’ve got a contentious member that will not respect the leadership that's been chosen by the church, and even though that leadership may not be perfect. At some point someone has to submit, you have to take actions." It can get unpretty.

I'm wondering, we do have a study guide that talks about How to survive in Church. It's actually a book I wrote, it's called How to survive in Church. I think we can send you a copy.

Ross: I'm going to call for that it's 800-835-6747. You're going to ask for the book How to survive in Church. Again, the number is 800-835-6747. Next caller we have is Cheryl listening from New York. Cheryl, welcome to the program.

Cheryl: Hi.

Doug: Hi Cheryl, thanks for calling.

Cheryl: Yes, thank you for taking my call. Okay, I'm not a Bible scholar but I read it and listen in church, and I have a question. In different places, it says, "To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord." Then somewhere else it says, "To be asleep in Christ." Then in Revelation it says, "The second resurrection, he shall judge the dead." When do you die and just go to heaven? Does your spirit just go to heaven or are you always asleep waiting? Who's to say who gets judge and stays asleep? If I'm reading it right.

Doug: Your great question, let me just dive in here that you're asking a question that's a very perceptive question. People read these different verses and they go, "What in the world--" They walk through a church cemetery and you'll have one tomb stone, it will say, "Our mother is singing with the angels." and the next tomb stone will say, "Our mother is resting in peace." Here's where the confusion comes in. The Bible says, "To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord." When you die, you think with your brain, your brain dies too.

Cheryl: Yes.

Doug: When the Lord comes, he resurrects you and you get a new glorified body.

Cheryl: Right.

Doug: Between the time when you die and the Lord resurrects you, you have no consciousness of time. Your next thought is the presence of the Lord, but the resurrection doesn't happen till the Lord comes is very clear. 1 Thessalonians 4 says, "The Lord will descend from heaven with a shout. The voice of the archangel, the trump of God, then, the dead in Christ will rise." 1 Corinthians 15 says, "The dead on Christ will rise at His coming." Jesus said, "The judgement and the resurrection are the last day."

That's called the day of the Lord, that's when they're raise. For a Christian who dies, they may have died a thousand years ago, for them, it's a moment, the twinkling of an eye, and the next thing they know--

Cheryl: Interesting. If you're saved.

Doug: If you're saved.

Cheryl: Interesting.

Doug: Well, even if you're lost, your next thing is the resurrection of the doom, which is terrible. Because there's no consciousness in death, the Bible says, “The living know they’ll die,” and this is Ecclesiastes 9, "The dead know not anything." I think King David said, "Those that go down onto the grave do not praise the Lord." [crosstalk]

Doug: Are those are the ones that are going to be preached?

Pastor: Jesus said, "Lazarus is asleep."

Cheryl: There's going to be judged and the second resurrection or but-- I've been a Christian since 1979. I read the scriptures, I try to be good. Is my spirit just going to go to heaven or am I going to be asleep in Christ, waiting for judgement too?

Doug: If you die believing your next thought is to come out of the grave. That may seem like a 5 seconds to you or less. It's going to be a twinkling of an eye. Now, let me give you example, Acts 2, Peter's preaching. He talks about King David, this is that great famous King David, there's only one David in the Bible. He's the one that killed the giant. A man after God's own heart, he is saved. Here's what Peter says.

Cheryl:

Doug: Peter says, "David is dead and buried, and not ascended to heaven." David died 3,000 years ago for us but it doesn't seem like that to us. The Bible says, "David slept with his father." He's been sleeping a dreamless sleep. I kind of knew I was sleeping last night because I had crazy dreams.

Cheryl: Yes.

Doug: When you don't even dream, it seems like no time has gone by [crosstalk]-

Cheryl: Right, right.

Doug: -and boom you're with the Lord. You know this last week, that great man, Billy Graham, passed away and everybody had him up in heaven talking with God and doing all these things. Technically, he's not there yet. For him, it will be the next thing he experiences but the resurrection hasn't happened. Can I send you a free study, please, on this subject? She would enjoy that new magazine we talked about.

Ross: Yes, absolutely, it's called The Afterlife Mystery. We'll be happy to send that to you, Cheryl. Or if you can also ask if you can't get that magazine right away, we do have a study guide called Are the Dead Really Dead? And it deals with this very subject. It gives you a lot of Bible truths.

Doug: You can read it free online.

Ross: Yes, just go to the Amazing Facts website. Amazingfacts.org. The number to call if you'd like us to mail that to you is 800-835-6747, 800-835-6747, ask for the study guide Are the Dead Really Dead?

Doug: Hey, Cheryl, let me jump in. You got a pencil?

Cheryl:

Doug: You got a pencil?

Cheryl: Yes, but can I just ask if you're cremated, what happens?

Doug: You'd still be resurrected because you're not using the old body, God's given you a brand new body. There's a sermon online, if you want to see something. You go to YouTube and type in The Witch of Endor, Doug Batchelor. Just type in Doug Batchelor, The Witch of Endor and it'll bring up a sermon I did on the very question you're asking. Thank you so much for your call.

Speaker 1: For life changing Christian resources, visit AFbookstore.com.

Speaker 9: Amazing Facts offer some of the best Christian resources for all ages. We hope our products will enrich your life and your walk with the Lord. Dead, a subject everyone thinks about but no one enjoys talking about. Is there life after death? The afterlife mystery is a brand new sharing magazine that answers all your questions.

Speaker 10: Get yours today by calling 800-538-7275 or visit AFbookstore.com.

Ross: We've got Fred listening in Michigan. Fred, welcome to the program.

Fred: God bless you, pastors.

Doug: Thank you.

Fred: What I always say is in the Chapter 13 of Revelation, my interpretation is that, there's a time period from when we left Europe to reformation so on. let down to the mark, the very end. What always got me is verse 13 where he make a fire come down from heaven and the earth, and the sign of men. I've come to believe that that's because that's where America was settled, and the lamb, and we end up speaking like a lion. To me, that is electricity.

Doug: Sorry, is your question, what does the fire coming down from heaven mean?

Fred: Yes, Just a little bit more here is that because I've read where 666 in Hebrew is WWW. To me, with electricity, as America got an electricity, and it says that by the wonders and by the deceit people, to me that's TV, that's Rock N' Roll, that's pornography, that's just everything or everything that comes from electricity. I know there's good things but by and large, to me, that's what that represent.

Doug: It's interesting, let me tell you something that goes along with that, because you got to turn this into a question pretty quick. It is interesting the first electronic message was sent in 1844 by Samuel Morse, did you know that?

Fred: No, sorry.

Doug: That was Morse code. Anyway, let me jump in because we're going to run out of time, we won't be able to answer your question. The fire coming down from heaven, when you understand something in the Bible, compare a scripture with scripture. In the Old Testament, you have a case where God brought down fire from heaven for Moses, fire came down from heaven when Elijah prayed, fire came down from heaven when the sacrifice was offered by Solomon, and that fire often represents the power of God. That fire came down from Heaven, or actually, God came up in the fire with Samson.

Ross: Tongues of fire in Acts 2.

Doug: It's often a symbol of God's power, but the devil can bring fire down from Heaven. He does in the book of Job. It's like in the last day, Satan is going to counterfeit the power of God. It's intriguing, what you said about electricity. From the time of , we're living in the last age of the Church. It is a time where there's electric fire, power. I never thought of that before.

Ross: increase, it says here, in the book of Daniel.

Pastor Doug: Absolutely. We have a study that talks about Revelation 13. We'll be happy to send you a free copy.

Ross: That's the one that talks about the United States in prophecy, the USA in prophecy.

Doug: Here you go.

Ross: it’s Revelation 13. The number to call to receive that is 800-835-6747. You can ask for the United States in prophecy. We'll be happy to send that to anybody who calls and asks. Next caller that we have is Jodie, listening from Texas. Jodie, you're on Bible Answers Live.

Jodie: Yes, sir. God bless you guys. You all are doing a great job, and I really like how you guys answer questions. I've got a quick question, I was always wondering on at the cross when Jesus was dying, and he mentioned why God had forsaken him. I never understood that, and it's probably pretty common. [crosstalk]

Doug: That's a good question, and when I first read that, I thought, “Wait a second, I thought Jesus never sinned and here it sounds like he lost faith. What's going on here? Or that he got discouraged.” Really, if you look, Psalm 22 is what they call one of the Messianic Psalms. Psalm 22 begins with, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" Pastor Ross, can look it up. I forget what verse it is, but later in that same Psalm it says, "They cast lots on my clothing. They pierced my hands and my feet. The dogs have encompassed me."

That Psalm describes the scenes of the cross. When Christ called out, he was quoting a verse. Everything Jesus did was Bible. Even from the cross, he's quoting from a Psalm that points to his sacrifice.

Ross: Psalm 22:1, "My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?"

Doug: Later in that Psalm, it talks about, "They pierced my hands and my feet." I forget what verse it is, and, "Dogs have encompassed me," and, "They cast lots on my clothing," and it's a psalm that talks about the very sufferings of Jesus on the cross.

Ross: Yes. You can look in verse 14, describes that, verse 16, verse 17. Verse 16 says, "They pierced my hands and my feet." Verse 17, "I can count all my bones. They look and stare at me. They divide my garment amongst them,” so there it is.

Doug: This could be one reason the thief on the cross, he heard Jesus quote that. He knew that verse from a child, and all of a sudden he looks. He sees everything in that Psalm is happening before his very eyes.

Jodie: like fulfilling prophecy.

Doug: Exactly. He was pointing to what that Psalm meant, and it's also a rhetorical question. "Why have you forsaken me?" Jesus knew why God had forsaken him. He's asking everyone to know Christ was, like Isaiah 53, the father withdrew his protection from him because he bore our sins. He's asking a rhetorical question in that Psalm and pointing them to those prophecies of the crucifixion. Thank you. I like that question.

Ross: Next caller we have is Jim, listening in Ohio. Jim, welcome to the program.

Jim: Hello. Good evening.

Doug: Thank you for your patience.

Jim: Yes. No problem. I was wondering about the two witnesses that's supposed to be at the end of times in Revelations.

Doug: Yes. Revelation 11.

Jim: Yes, and back in Abraham's time and Lot, and Jesus, when he rose from the grave, there was these two that talked to Abraham.

Doug: Yes. You're talking about when Moses and Elijah appeared. Let me jump in before we run out of time. You're on the right track. Moses appeared to Jesus. Moses was resurrected. You read in the book of Jude, Elijah went to Heaven in a fiery chariot. They represent the law and the prophets, the Commandments of God and the testimony of Jesus. They are a symbol of the two witnesses, meaning that the word of God, the law and the prophets, were testifying that Jesus was the one they all pointed to, and so this was a fulfillment of that.

We have a book we can give you on that subject, and it is called The Two Witnesses. It's called The Glorious Mount. It's the two witnesses, and if you just call, we'll send you a free copy of that, anyone who wants to understand that magnificent passage and who the two witnesses are, ask for this free book.

Ross: The number to call is 800-835-6747, and again, the book is called The Two Witnesses: The Glorious Mount. Just ask for that and we'll be happy to send that to anyone who calls and asks. Pastor Doug, there's some exciting things happening and amazing facts. I know we have some listeners around the world, but you and I will be getting on a plane tomorrow to head over to India for a couple weeks.

Doug: That's right. We've got people all across India that watch the programs. I think we'll be in two or three cities over there, and in Dubai, in the Middle East, but the program here will continue and make sure and check out the Amazing Facts YouTube site. We've got hundreds of sermons there and you can go to our website amazingfacts.org

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