Secret's Buried At Sea?

Date: 05/20/2007 
On August 23, 1799 the American ship Nancy was captured in the Caribbean Sea by the English Navy and taken to Jamaica. At the time Britain was at war with France, Spain and Holland. And the Royal Navy was active in preventing neutral countries from trading weapons with their enemies or their colonies.
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How about an amazing fact? On August 23, 1799 the American ship Nancy was captured in the Caribbean Sea by the English Navy and taken to Jamaica. At the time Britain was at war with France, Spain and Holland. And the Royal Navy was active in preventing neutral countries from trading weapons with their enemies or their colonies. The English claimed that Nancy had been supplying weapons to a Dutch Colony in the Southern Caribbean and that the ship should be confiscated as a prize of war. But, the court did not find any real evidence that was against the Nancy and was about to release the ship when an English Lieutenant rushed into the courtroom.

He had proof he said that the Nancy was guilty of smuggling arms to the Dutch. Then he held out several red papers that had just been taken out of the stomach of a shark. Those papers did indeed prove the Nancy guilty. The Captain of the Nancy had thrown them overboard when he realized his ship was to be captured. But, a passing shark had swallowed the papers and the damaging evidence was found when the big fish was caught and cut open.

Did you know friends that a time is coming when the hidden deeds of men and women will be open for the investigation of the entire Universe? Stay tuned for more as “Amazing Facts” brings you this edition of “Bible Answers Live”.


Pastor Ross: Hello friends and welcome back to this National and International Bible study. My name is Jean Ross. Pastor Doug Batchelor is out of town this evening. But, we want to encourage you to call in with your Bible questions. Again we open up the word of God and we study together wanting to find Bible answers to your questions. If you have a Bible related question the number to call right here to the studio is 1-800-GOD-SAYS that’s 1-800-463-7297we have phone lines that are open so this is a good time to call. Like I said my name is Jean Ross and sitting in with us working the phones is Pastor and Evangelist John Bradshaw. John thank you and welcome to “Bible Answers Live”.

Pastor John: Thank you Jean and it is good to be here and it is good to be back as a matter of fact. I was here well it has been some time. I was trying to think it may be as long as six years maybe four, maybe five I was thinking of on the way in; it has been awhile. But, I have been here so thanks for the welcome back.

Pastor Ross: Alright. You are working the phones for us tonight and we really appreciate that. Friends, you probably notice an accent. You have two accents behind the microphones tonight. John is from New Zealand.

Pastor John: Originally from New Zealand. And our great rivals in the sporting arena are the South Africans.

Pastor Ross: In the area of cricket and rugby.

Pastor John: Yeah well cricket we don’t have to talk about because rugby is where we have a fighting chance against the South Africans.


Pastor John: We better lead the conversation in another direction before we reminisce about the good old days.

Pastor Ross: That’s right. Well let’s begin the program with prayer and then we’ll take our question for tonight.

Pastor John: Father in heaven we thank you for the opportunity to consider the things of heaven tonight and we pray for a special blessing. We ask that your Spirit would indeed guide us and that hearts would be directed towards the things of heaven. And with Jesus Christ Himself may we find safety and peace in Him. Thank you for being with us and in Jesus’ name we pray. Amen.

Pastor Ross: Amen. We opened the program with talk about an incredible ship by the name of Nancy that was proven guilty of smuggling arms to the Dutch as a result of a capture of a shark. Cut open and there were the papers that actually condemned the ship. We then said that a time is coming when the hidden deeds of men and women will be open to the investigation of the entire Universe. And of course the event that we are talking about is the judgment that’s described in heaven. In 11 Corinthians Chapter 5:10 we read, “For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ that everyone may receive the things done in the body according to that what he has done; whether good or bad.” And in Luke Chapter 17:18 Jesus says, “For nothing is secret that shall not be revealed; nor anything hidden that will not be made known and come to light.” Jeremiah Chapter 17:10 10 “I the Lord, search their hearts and test the mind even to give every man according to his ways; according to the fruit of his doing.” And then the fourth text that we have related to the judgment, Revelation 20:12 “And I saw the dead, small and great standing before God and the books were opened and another book was opened which was the book of life and the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which are written in the books.” Now Pastor John we recognize that this theme of the judgment is throughout Scripture. But, it is more than just a onetime event. Rather it is made up of some different phases.

Pastor John: And that is true. Indeed it is. In fact, not everything that takes place on heaven is akin to what takes place on earth. But, if you think of an earthly judgment; there are several different phases of an earthly judgment. To begin with, we are familiar with a court trial. Is that right?

Pastor Ross: That’s right.

Pastor John: We call that the investigation. We’ve got to find out what actually happened out there.

Pastor Ross: Examining the evidence.

Pastor John: That’s right. And then there is going to be a verdict. Guilty or not guilty or somewhere in between if that is at all possible. And then after that what happens? There is the carrying out of the verdict. Either the accused is set free or the jail or fined or whatever it might be.

Pastor Ross: So you follow that with the Biblical idea of that with the judgment we see three phases. The first phase is what we sometimes refer to as the investigative phase. Well the pre-advent phase this takes place before Jesus comes. But, the book of Revelation says that when Jesus comes He brings His rewards with Him to give every man according to his works. So there is some type of investigation that takes place before Jesus comes.

Pastor John: There has to be. I’d like to say that if you were going to Grandma’s on Christmas day and you were going to take a gift. You have to figure out before you go to Grandma’s before you go what gift to take. If Jesus is going to come back with His reward He is going to decide before what reward to bring.

Pastor Ross: And then we have a 1000 year period that Revelation 20 speaks of where the redeemed will be in heaven and Paul makes a remarkable statement where he says, “Know you not that you shall judge angels?” So during this 1000 years there is this judgment where the righteous, the saints, will be examining the books of record in heaven. And I guess the bottom line of that is not that anyone is going to have the verdict changed, if they are guilty suddenly they are going to be innocent. But, rather in the minds of the redeemed it is going to confirm God’s decision that He has done everything He can to possibly save mankind.

Pastor John: And doesn’t that tell you something about God? Not only is God just, but He will be seen to be just. He doesn’t owe us that. Surely He could just say take my word for it. But, there’s something about God that he is not only just, but He will be seen to be just. And I think that sheds a lot of light on the character of God.

Pastor Ross: Absolutely. And then we have the third and final phase of the judgment and that happens at the end of the 1000 years period that you can read about in Revelation Chapter 20 where the wicked are resurrected and they stand before God’s white throne and the Greta White Throne judgment and at the end of that final phase, sin and satan and his angels and the wicked are destroyed and the Universe is cleansed from sin forever. What a glorious day that will be. What a fulfilled promise for the redeemed. Look for a new heaven and a new earth where there is no sickness, no pain, no suffering. You know I have stood at too many open graves and done too many funerals and when I am tired of that and when that day comes there will be no more death and no more sorrow. That’s the great hope of the Christian.

Pastor John: Thank God for that. Are we ready to take some calls Pastor Jean?

Pastor Ross: Well before we do that, we have some internet questions that we need to get to. But, before we get to the internet questions pastor John we have a free offer dealing with the judgment. Folks might have some questions about that and it is an “Amazing Facts” study guide entitled “Case Closed” so if you’d like to receive this study guide talking about judgment call the recourse line and John would you give that number?

Pastor John: I have the resource line at 1-800-835-6747 and I’ll repeat it 1-800-835-6747 and if you’d like to receive our free study guide it’s a good one “Case Closed” on this very subject that Pastor Jean is talking about tonight. Call the number again 1-800-835-6747.

Pastor Ross: Alright we want to take some internet questions and by the way if you’d like to send us a question via the internet go to the “Amazing Facts” website and you can click on the link contact us and you can type in a question. What do we have tonight Pastor John?

Pastor John: First question we have from the internet. My question is on regards to Old Testament laws. I believe that the Ten Commandants are still binding. But, what about all of the other laws found in the Old Testament? Overall how do we know which laws are still binding and which are not?

Pastor Ross: That’s a good question. We need to look at the laws overall. There are four divisions and start with the moral laws and The Ten Commandants. Those commandments are still just as binding today as they were then and it is still a sin to kill and the penalty is death.

Then we have the second division of the laws and it is sometimes referred to as the ceremonial laws. Those are the laws connected with the sanctuary the sacrificing of the lamb. There are a number of laws connected and certain feast days connected to that as well. All of those pointed forward to Jesus. I mean Jesus died on the cross, but those ceremonial laws came to an end.

We have this third set of laws that are referred to as civil laws and they have to do with the governing of the Nation of Israel. The principles of those laws are true and many of those laws are included in the democratic nations of the earth, but that was more in a theocracy where God was governing. God was king over Israel. The principles are still there.

Then the fourth area of laws that we have in the Old Testament are the health laws. Now the health laws are binding in that they were given so that we can be healthy. The anatomy of a Jew didn’t change the minute Jesus died on the cross. So the health laws are practical good principles proven scientifically to bring about health, and strength. Now there is a verse we find related to this in Colossians Chapter 2:14 speaking of the different types of law. Speaking of the crucifixion of Jesus says, 14 “Having blotted out the hand written ordinances that bring against us and are contrary to us. He took them out of the way nailing them to the cross.” 17 “Which were a shadow of things to come, but the body is Christ’s.” Those ceremonial laws that pointed forward to Jesus and His atoning sacrifice. They came to an end when Jesus died on the cross.

Pastor John: Amen. Alright. I can say amen to that.

Pastor Ross: Alright what is our second internet question for tonight?

Pastor John: Second internet question is just a little bit different and here it is. Who is Michael the arch angel?

Pastor Ross: Good question. You know there are different ideas today about who Michael the arch angel is. Some people feel he is the angel or the most important angel that we have in heaven. But, what does the Bible say? Well Michael is referenced several times and the one I want to begin with is in Revelation Chapter 12: 7 so the Bible says, “There was war in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon and the dragon and his angels fought.” Now who is this Michael? Who is his angels and who is the dragon? Well the dragon is identified later on in Revelation Chapter 12 as the devil, that old serpent that deceives men and women. But, who is Michael? Well there are four verses we can look at to help us understand this in Daniel Chapter 12:1 it says that Michael is the great prince that stands for the children of our people. Jesus is the one who intercedes on our behalf, He stands for us. Jude Chapter 9 says Michael is the arch angel. Now I just want to clarify that we are not saying that Jesus or Michael is an angel. Rather he is the arch or the ruler of the angels and I want to be real clear on that.

Pastor John: You are going to have to be real clear because I have had conversations with people on that subject and you will tell them five times. I am not telling you that Jesus is a created being. But, somehow this is engrained so we want to stress that you’re not saying Jesus is a created being.

Pastor Ross: Jesus is the creator. He created all things. But, him being the arch angel he is the ruler and he is the one above and he is the one in charge of the angels. In Jude Chapter 1:9 it says that Michael is the arch angel. And here is the important point. 1 Thessalonians Chapter 4:16 says, “The Lord himself will descend from heaven with a shout…” now get this “… with the voice of the arch angel and the dead in Christ will rise first.” So when Jesus descends he will have the voice of the arch angel and the dead in Christ will rise. Then in John Chapter 5:28 Jesus says, “All that are in their graves will hear His voice…” speaking of the son of man and “… and they shall come forth.” So if you put these four verses together Michael then is the prophetic name for Jesus.

Pastor John: He is the head over the angels and He’s the one whose voice that people will hear when they are summoned from their dusty beds.

Pastor Ross: Well said, absolutely.

Pastor John: And He is not a created being.

Pastor Ross: He is not a created being. Let’s go to the phone lines then.

Pastor John: And amen. Let’s do that then. You started this time around with a vessel called the Nancy. And quite by well call it what you want, our first caller is calling from Bakersfield, California and her name is Nancy welcome to the program Nancy.

Nancy: Hi.

Pastor Ross: Hi Nancy. What is your question?

Nancy: I just have a question about owning a gun in a Christian home. Is it appropriate? I don’t agree with it, but I know couple of people that do so I just want to know your opinion on it.

Pastor Ross: Sure. Well it’s a good question. Let me begin by saying that I don’t think having a gun in the home is necessarily wrong. I mean a gun is used for different things. Like some people use it or a rifle for recreational purposes. Some people who live on a farm might need a gun for the work they are involved with whatever the work might be. But, there is a principle we find in the Bible and Jesus alluded to that when the high priests and the soldiers came to take Him away. Peter pulled out his sword and chopped of the high priest’s servant’s ear. Are you familiar with that?

Nancy: Umm-hmm.

Pastor Ross: And then Jesus said to Peter, put away the sword. He who lives by the sword shall die by the sword or die with the sword. I think it is important for us to remember that our hope of peace, safety and security is in Jesus and He will take care of us we can trust in Him and He will take care of us. Having said that I don’t think it is a sin to have a gun depending upon what they are using it for. Does that make sense?

Nancy: Yes it does. I had read through that Scripture like a few weeks ago and it gave me the reassurance that I don’t need to own a gun in the home.

Pastor Ross: That’s right our faith and the angels are far greater and stronger than any handgun that anyone can get. And if our lives are hid with Christ we don’t have to fear. God will take care of us and He’ll provide for us and protect us in every situation that we might be in. Alright, Nancy?

Nancy: Okay thank you very much.

Pastor Ross: Thank you for calling good question.

Pastor John: Thanks Nancy. Our next call comes from Michigan and we’re going to go to Dave in Michigan. Hi Dave, welcome to the “Bible Answers Live”.

Dave: Good evening.

Pastor Ross: Good evening and your question for tonight?

Dave: Well I guess basically is the United States mentioned in prophecy?

Pastor Ross: Is the United States mentioned in Bible prophecy? That’s a good question. The answer is yes. As a matter of fact Revelation Chapter 13 describes a beast and in Bible prophecy and remember that a beast represents a country or a kingdom. Revelation 13 actually describes two beasts. The first is coming up out of the sea and the second is coming up out of the earth. That second beat that is coming up out of the earth is identified as the United States in Bible prophecy. Now it is an in depth study and we can no t go over all of them tonight in this program, but I would recommend the study guide that “Amazing Facts “ has entitled “The USA in Bible Prophecy” and it deals with this second beast of Revelation Chapter 13. So if you would like to receive this just call the resource number and they would be happy to send it out to you. “The USA in Bible Prophecy” and by the way anyone who is listening and would like to know more about what the Bible says about the United States in Bible prophecy call the resource number.

Pastor John: And that number 1-800-835-6747. 1-800-835-6747 and ask for “The USA in Bible Prophecy” we thank you for the call and our next caller is in Davis, West Virginia and this is Jackie. Hi Jackie.

Jackie: HiPastor John. My question is in reference to my friend who is widowed and has reconnected to a former boyfriend who is divorced and he committed adultery. On what grounds can he re-marry?

Pastor Ross: That is a good question. Jesus states very clearly a couple of places Matthew Chapter 19: 3-19 Jesus says that if a person commits adultery within a marriage that then enables the person to get remarried. Other than that there isn’t too much solid evidence for getting a divorce and getting remarried.

Jackie: Even if his x-wife has since remarried? Or even deceased would that still give no grounds for this man to remarry?

Pastor Ross: Let’s deal with first if someone has passed away then the person is free to marry you know the wedding vows are until death do us part.

Jackie: Even if he has committed adultery?

Pastor Ross: Well if someone has committed adultery then the other person id free to get remarried. So let’s say in this case a man and woman get divorced and he remarries. Then she would be free to remarry as well because in the Biblical terms one of them did commit adultery. Even though they were divorced or separated before that.

Pastor John: Now Jackie are we getting your question right because what I am hearing you ask is a man was married to a woman and the man committed adultery and the woman died. Is that what you’re asking?

Jackie: Yes.

Pastor Ross: If he has confessed and asked for forgiveness and his former wife is passed away then I see there is nothing hindering him from getting remarried.

Jackie: Okay so if she is not passed away, but she is remarried.

Pastor Ross: She got remarried right, right. And if he has confessed his sins and he is sorry about that then yes he would be free to remarry if she is already remarried.

Jackie: Okay. Thank you. You have answered my question. Thank you.

Pastor John: I think it is important to remember that fornication and adultery are sins that are very serious and there are certain steps to be taken, but it is not the unpardonable sin. And we don’t want people who have made those kinds of mistakes that God does not love them or they are outside of the reach of God’s grace or that God won’t hear their prayers. There are certain steps to take and not that you can undo what has been done, but it is very serious.

Pastor Ross: That’s the point that we want to remember that it is very serious. Plus our listener’s realize the pain that something like that can bring. But, if someone is truly repentant and gives their heart to God after asking for forgiveness we trust that God will forgive and saves us.

Pastor John: Now Joe who is in West Virginia. We want to say hi Joe. Welcome to the program and go right on with your question.

Joe: Hi. I have a question about when and where in the Bible it says that Jesus descends to Hades with the saints in hell?

Pastor Ross: Well first of all let me ask you why are you asking if Jesus descended into hell?

Joe: I heard a preacher preach on that and talk about it.

Pastor Ross: Okay Pastor John I believe you can get it where it says that when Jesus died He preached to the spirits that were in hell?

Pastor John: Yeah Peter wrote about that and said well it said that somebody preached to the spirits in prison. Boy I have heard some creative sermons on this. There Jesus was He went walking through hell. There were pits all around and the rats screamed and the demons shrieked and Jesus and Satan stood. You’ve heard this sermon. And Satan stood frozen and Jesus walked up to him and looked him in the eye and snatched the keys out of his hand and I love that sermon, but the problem is it didn’t come out of the Bible. It came out of somebody’s fantastic and rather overactive imagination.

Pastor Ross: Right and again that is a result of someone’s misunderstood verse that is 1 Peter if you want to look it up. 1 Peter Chapter 3:20-21.

Pastor John: In fact let me start reading verse 18 shall I? 1 Peter 3: 18 “Christ also had suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God; being put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;”

Pastor Ross: Now that’s the key there; go ahead.

Pastor John: Alright, 1 Peter 3: verse 19 “by which He went and preached unto the spirits in prison,”

Pastor Ross: And then verse 20.

Pastor John: What is verse 20 going to tell us? Will it tell us which spirits and which prison? 1 Peter 3: 20 “who one time were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah while the ark was being prepared, wherein few, (that is, eight souls) were saved by water.”

Pastor Ross: Well it tells us which speaking of when, 20…which were sometime disobedient when the longsuffering God waited in the days of Noah…” Now here’s the point; some people believe that when Jesus died that He somehow descended down into hell and preached to people that were sort of in that holding place that lived before the flood. But, that is not what the Scripture is saying here. The emphasis is the spirit which speaks about Jesus died and rose again and the spirit brought Him to life and it was by that spirit that Jesus pleaded or spoke to those; even in the days of Noah, the Holy Spirit spoke to those in those days. In Genesis God spoke and he said my spirit shall not always strive with man, but their days shall be 120. So we have in Genesis God’s Spirit striving with those before the flood and Peter is alluding to this and is saying it is by the spirit that Jesus preached to those before the flood. It is not about Jesus dying and going into hell and preaching to people. Does that make sense?

Joe: Yes.

Pastor John: And if we understand correctly what the Bible says about what happens when people die. We know when the Bible says they die they sleep until the resurrection. If Jesus did go to someplace called hell; He’d have found a bunch of sleeping people there who weren’t listening very clearly or carefully to His sermons.

Pastor Ross: Absolutely.

Pastor John: And we know what that is like.

Pastor Ross: Absolutely. Well Joe thanks for the call; good question.

Pastor John: And we’re going to go to New York, New York now and Joseph is with us. And Joseph welcome to “Bible Answers Live” and go right ahead with your question.

Joseph: Thank you gentlemen. I’m referring to John 6: 42, I believe it begins at 42; did you want to read it?

Pastor Ross: Okay let me read it for you; I’ve got it here, it says, “And they said, ‘Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How is it then he saith, I came down from heaven?’ ”

Joseph: My question is this, why wasn’t everyone aware from talking to their neighbors about the virgin birth? If they knew about the virgin birth, why would they be asking such a question?

Pastor Ross: Okay well good question. Well first of all let’s take note that these words were said some thirty years after Jesus. So a long time had passed so probably the discussion that had been in Nazareth and then again in Bethlehem where Jesus born in connection to the virgin birth a lot of that discussion had died down by this time. And Jesus He treated Joseph as his father and he worked with him there in the carpenter shop. So those around, the neighbors and those in the community, they thought Jesus was the son of Joseph. I don’t think the virgin birth was proclaimed or publicized. People wouldn’t quite understand it, but it was something that Mary kept in her heart because the angel revealed it to Joseph.

Pastor John: And you remember he was so exercised about this he was mindful to put her away.

Pastor Ross: That’s right. He wasn’t going to tell anybody this is of the Holy Spirit.

Joseph: Sir, when you opened the program you mentioned something about secrecy nothing being kept in secret. That seems to be contradictory of the secrecy of the virgin birth.

Pastor Ross: Well it might have been at that time, but it is not a secret anymore. You know Jesus said that anything that is done in secret will be revealed. And by the grace of God the Christ’s birth, the virgin birth is being proclaimed without a doubt it is not a secret anymore.

Pastor John: I don’t want to come off wrong here, but this is just I’m reaching back into the depths of my memory Pastor jean. It seems that the religious leaders in Christ’s day had some inkling as to the circumstances surrounding His birth because there’s a place in the gospels where they cast dispersions upon Jesus and kind of spoke around about to Christ about regarding the circumstances of His birth.

Pastor Ross: Well of course He bypassed the palaces. He didn’t go to the religious schools of the day and so He really wasn’t in favor with the Jews leaders and they were looking for every excuse they possibly can.

Pastor John: You know it seems to me that they knew.

Pastor Ross: Well of course we have the prophecy of Isaiah that says that a virgin shall conceive and bear a son; so they were aware of the virgin birth, but they really didn’t want to make too much of a deal or too big of a deal with that. Does that help?

Pastor John: Well thank you for your question sir.

Joseph. Yes. Thank you.

Pastor Ross: Alright. Thanks for calling Joseph. You know we can hear the music playing there in the background. We are coming up on or half an hour break, so don’t go away friends. We’re going to have another half an hour of questions. We have a few lines that are still open so we encourage you to call the number right into the studio is 1-800-GOD-SAYS or 1-800 463-7297. We also want to remind you about our free offer it is “Case Closed” it deals with the judgment and it’s an “Amazing Facts” study guide to receive that call the resource number 1-800-835-6747 and friends we will be back in just few minutes and we also want to remind you about the “Amazing Facts” website and we’ll talk more about some websites when we get back in just a few minutes. But, don’t go away, you might want to contact a friend and tell them to tune in to “Bible Answers Live”. Thank you again and we will be back in just a minute.


Pastor Ross: Hello friends welcome back to “Bible Answers Live” my name is Pastor Jean Ross. Pastor Doug is out his evening, but working the phones is Pastor John Bradshaw. Glad that he is with us here and we are going to take our questions here pretty soon, but let me just share a few internet sites. We like to do this so you can go and study further for yourself. We have the “Amazing Facts” website that is filled with all kinds of resources. Just a great study tool and we encourage you to go by there. And we have some other ones. Sometimes we get questions relating to hell. What happens with the wicked? We spoke a little bit about this at the beginning of our program when we dealt with the judgment.

Pastor John: Umm-hmm.

Pastor Ross: If someone has questions on that, they can go to the website “Hell truth dot org” and they can study more about that important subject. The questions come up from time to time about the Sabbath. We have a website “Sabbath Truth dot com” or “dot org” and you can learn more about the Sabbath. All of these websites can also be accessed from the “Amazing Facts” website so we want to encourage you to go take a look at that and if you have any internet questions; just type it in and we’ll be happy to try and answer it here on the air. Just a reminder a phone number here for your questions is 1-800-GOD-SAYS or 1-800-463-7297.

Pastor John: And Kevin has been waiting patiently in Arlington, Washington. He’s listening online. Kevin thank you for waiting and welcome to “Bible Answers Live”.

Kevin: Yeah I was just wondering specifically—it is kind of two questions in one I guess—specifically what the Bible says about wedding rings and then also specifically about music genres?

Pastor Ross: Alright good question. Well let’s begin with the music. And then maybe we can talk a little bit about the wedding ring. The Bible is filled with music. The Psalms is all about music and music is important. You can read in Revelation how the angels worship God and sing praises to Him. So music plays an important part in worship. However, let me mention that music can be used for good and also it can be used for bad. You know the devil before his fall; the devil and Lucifer in heaven, many believe that he was very gifted in the areas of music so he’s an expert in understanding and knowing music. So no doubt he is using that as well to propagate his ideology and his lies about God. So music, we need to be careful as to what type of music we listen to. And having said that it is not just the words, but it is also the music that creates an atmosphere for the words.

Pastor John: And I think instinctively that people know that. You know you hear certain music on the radio that is created to make you shake your groove thing. Remember that song? In the ‘70s I mean some music just does that. Alright and you can hardly imagine that being the music in heaven and therefore that me as a Christian that is looking to worship should be turning over in my mind. Does that make sense?

Kevin: Yes.

Pastor John: And remember what the Bible says that what so ever things are true, just, lovely and of good report; I choose those. If there be any good; think and pray on these things. You know you can open a can of worms or a drum or worms or a container of worms with this subject.

Pastor Ross: That’s right. Well you know now that we have spoken about music let’s take it the next step and that has to do with the wedding ring. Is it right or wrong to wear the wedding ring? The Bible speaks about jewelry and it is quite clear that Paul and peter both speak of let not the adorning be of wearing gold or silver, but rather let it be the hidden man of the heart; not putting on outward apparel. So for a Christian we want to avoid that which brings undue attention to oneself. Now the wedding ring it is a sensitive area and I as I said we want to be careful in this. There are countries and places where a wedding ring is looked at as being very important to wear if you are married. And if someone is married and they are not wearing a wedding ring it is looked upon rather negatively. But, that is not the case necessarily in every culture. So when it comes to the wedding ring it does serve a purpose. But, I think that dependent upon the circumstances that one finds themselves in a decision needs to be made on that. So I think it is hard to come up with just a blanket statement. Personally on my conviction, I can say I don’t wear a wedding ring. I’ve never run into any problems with this. My wife doesn’t, but again depending upon where you are and the culture of the place where you are I think that does come into play as well. Does that help a little Kevin?

Kevin: Okay well I’ve heard some of that before. I was just wondering if you had any text on it about what you mentioned about Lucifer in heaven? Like being the overseer of the music or anything?

Pastor Ross: Yes. Let me see if I can pull up a few verses on here when we talk about the fall. Of course you know when Satan was in heaven he was this beautiful being and you can read about it Isaiah Chapter 14: 12. It speaks concerning Lucifer and describes some of his what he was like. And it speaks about the pipes within him is the phrase that is alluded to there. And some have understood that as being his musical ability.

Kevin: Okay.

Pastor Ross: That’s Isaiah Chapter 14.

Kevin: Okay. Thank you.

Pastor Ross: Alright. Also Ezekiel Chapter 28: 14-17 also deals with that. Thank you for calling Kevin.

Pastor John: Thanks Kevin. We appreciate that and there is a verse in the Bible that says here is the patience of the saints. And Pam in Leary, California has given that a whole new understanding tonight. Pam thank you for hanging in there and welcome to “Bible Answers Live” I think you’ve got a good question for Pastor Jean tonight.

Pam: Good evening gentlemen and thanks for taking out call. Can you give us your understanding, belief and explanation of Daniel 12:12?

Pastor Ross: Okay Daniel Chapter 12:12. Let me pull it up here for you. Do you have it there in front of you?

Pam: Yes.

Pastor Ross: Would you read that for us?

Pam: Sure. 12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

Pastor Ross: Okay. So we have this time period one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days. Now there are different ways to look at this. If we look at the prophetic days one day is equal to one thousand years. It would begin in 508 A.D. and if you go from 508 A.D. and you go forward in time one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days. You end up in the year 1843. Now somebody might ask well what is the significance of 1943? And what is the significance of 508? Well one of the obstacles that was hindering the supremacy of the medieval church, the papacy power, was one of the pagan kings, Clovis. In 508, he was overcome or conquered opening up full papal domination in Europe. Then we continue forward in time to the year 1843. What happened in 1843? Well we had the proclamation of the soon coming of Jesus and the great Millerite awakening and not only in Europe, but the United States and all the countries in South America where there was an interest in the prophecies of Scripture and imparticular the book of Daniel. People began to study these things and understand the truths of Scripture. It was this great religious awakening. That’s why the verse says blessed is he that waiteth and cometh to the one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days. And then verse 13 speaking to Daniel. “But you go your way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.” So this one thousand three hundred and thirty-five day or year time period reaches all the way through to the very time of the end.

Pastor John: Now that was a good answer and I appreciate that.

Pastor Ross: Did that help?

Pam: I am still a little confused. But, I am going to do some more studying.

Pastor Ross: I would encourage you to do some more studying. It is a deep subject here. But, jus real quick some time frames so you can keep that in mind why we say 508 is when Clovis was converted he was king of the French and he was converted to the Catholic faith. And that opened up the way for the papal power supremacy that rules for a period of time during the Dark Ages and then we have the end of the one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days ending in 1843. And we have the proclamation is given of the coming of Jesus and there is a revived interest in the prophecies of Daniel.

Pam: Well thank you very much gentlemen.

Pastor Ross: Okay. Well thank you for your call Pam we appreciate it.

Pastor John: Thank you. Pam was listening in on KARM and it is possible that we have a study guide that goes similar to that or what I am trying to say is “Right on Time” if you call our resource number 1-800-835-6747 and ask for “Right on Time” Pam or anyone you are going to get some more information.

Pastor Ross: Well not only can you call the resource line for that study guide, but you can also go to the “Amazing Facts” website and like I said you can read about that. Like I said that is a deep study and we were just giving you a quick overview and we really encourage you to go to the website and learn more.

Pastor John: It is a deep subject. Betty is in Coldwell, Washington listening on KEIT. Betty welcome to “Bible answers Live” and go ahead with your question.

Betty: Thank you very much. I was reading and wondering about Ezekiel 20:25 and how it kind of contradicts things like in verse 11 and verse 13 also.

Pastor Ross: Well alright let’s see if we can open that up. Do you have that in front of you?

Betty: Yes I have.

Pastor Ross: Would you read Ezekiel Chapter20:25?

Betty: Ezekiel 20: 25 “Wherefore I gave them also my statutes that were not good, and judgments whereby they should not live;” and I was wondering what it means?

Pastor Ross: Okay. Let me open it up here. I am having a hard time with my little software I’d like to read it here as well. Ezekiel and you said Chapter 20: 25, let’s see if this will work here.

Pastor John: For one thing you know for sure God here is certainly not talking about the Ten Commandments. The Bible says they were holy and just and good. So scratch that off the list. Was he talking about the ceremonial laws? Well it is hard to think that the things he said up to point forward to the coming of the Messiah and to help the people understand the gospel of what was way back then I would imagine God would not be saying that they are not good. So what would that tie us into?

Pastor Ross: It would have to tie us into the ceremonial law.

Betty: It says here in verse 11 and it says they shall not live.

Pastor Ross: Well I got my software to work. So I can read it. Let’s look at verse 13; you brought that one up, 13 “But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness; they walk not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if any man do, he shall even live in them; and my Sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.” So here in Ezekiel we have the account of the children of Israel which are traveling out of Egypt up to the Promised Land. Again and again they rebelled against God and at one time God actually sent a plague through Israel to consume many of them because of their disobedience and rejection of His judgments and promises. So these judgments spoken of here are what God gave Israel which they were to do which pointed forward to the coming of the Messiah. But, Israel didn’t do that and they rejected that and they would for awhile and then they would wander away; and then they’d slide back and they would always live an on again off again thing with their commitment and relationship to Jesus. And you gave another verse Ezekiel 20:11 and it says, 11 “And I gave them my statutes, and shewed them my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them.” 12 “Moreover I gave them my Sabbaths to be a sign between me and them that they might know I am the Lord that sanctify them. 13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and despised my judgments, which if any man do he shall live in them; and my Sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.” Ezekiel is talking about the statutes that God had given Israel.

Betty: Is that why he was saying they were not good and they were or should not live them?

Pastor Ross: No the statutes were good and if the Israelites would have followed the statutes and the laws that God had given them, they would have prospered, but they rejected these statutes and that is why judgment had come upon Israel.

Betty: Oh okay. Okay well thank you very much. Good question. Thank you for calling Betty.

Pastor John: Allen is in Milwaukee, Oregon listening on KPDQ and we want to welcome Allen to “Bible Answers Live”. Hi Allen go right ahead.

Allen: Okay thanks for taking my call. This has to do with the Ten Commandments. It says, Exodus 20: 4 “You shall not make yourself any carved or graven images of any likeness of anything that is in the likeness of anything in the heaven above or that is in earth.” And I am just kind of wondering why the Jesus and angels and especially the long haired kind of hippie types like Jesus pictures and paintings of Jesus are not considered a breaking of the second commandment? And it is made with hands.

Pastor Ross: Alright. Good question, but read the next verse if you have it there in front of you; you read Exodus Chapter 20: 4 and read verse 5 as well.

Allen: Yeah well that is part of the commandment to not bow down to them yeah.

Pastor Ross: So in verse 4 we find God telling do not make any graven image or likeness of anything in heaven above or in earth or is under the water of the earth. 5”Then you shall not bow down yourself, nor serve them…” Now God is not against making an image perhaps of something in nature and I will give you an example of that. When God told the Israelites to build a sanctuary and God gave the plans to Moses. We find that on the base on the ladle in the courtyard there were these oxen bearing it up with angels embroidered in the curtains inside the sanctuary and the priest wore pomegranates on the hem of his robe. So we do find a likeness made of things. The key is bowing down and worshipping them. Now I do know there are some religions where a picture of a guru or a leader is placed on the wall and people actually do bow down and worship that. And that of course is wrong. But, to have a photo of a loved one it wouldn’t be wrong if you don’t make an idol out of that, if you don’t bow down and worship that.

Allen: Well I have always taken it as being a commandment with two parts in it. One is actually making and the other is bowing down to it.

Pastor Ross: Yeah I don’t think it is in the making because as I mentioned in the sanctuary in the wilderness and also in the sanctuary that Solomon built we have the likeness of different things. Angels, we have different types of animals. The key though is bowing down and worshipping them.

Allen: Okay and then the other part of that is 1 Corinthians 11 it says, “Should man have long hair…” and most of the things that I see with Jesus is the long hair.

Pastor Ross: Jesus with the long hair. Now I think a lot of that has to do with a tradition that has been around for a long time. Most likely people did not shave their heads like we do today. I have short very short and part of the reason is my hair is falling out. So I like to keep it short, but I don’t believe back in Bible times that they did that. Now how long was Jesus’ hair? Was it down to his shoulders? We don’t know.

Pastor John: The question is how long is long? What was he driving at there? Was he saying real long that down to your waist is real long?

Pastor Ross: If it touches your collar would that be long? So I think that hair as far as the picture goes of Jesus that has been greatly influenced by tradition. How close is it to what Jesus really looked like? It is hard to say.

Allen: Okay well I appreciate your answers.

Pastor Ross: Good question Allen and thank you for calling.

Pastor John: Katho is listening in on WGOD and he is calling from St. Thomas and he is calling from the Virgin Islands. Katho welcome to “Bible Answers Live” please go right ahead.

Katho: Hi and good evening.

Pastor Ross: Hi.

Katho: I used to associate with a denomination and one thing they do not accept is they say that we men should be leaders or pastors in the church not to give them prayer or open prayer or anything like that. You know today when we look we see so many of them are pastors and my friends are telling me about that we men should remain silent in the church and if you have a question, let them ask your husband. But, they use these to say we men should not take responsibility for this and stuff like that, let them have somebody.

Pastor Ross: Okay good question. The verse you are referring to there is 1Timothy Chapter 2: 12 or starting at verse 11 to get it in context. It says, 11 “Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.12 But, I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over a man, but to be in silence.” Now we want to look at the context here that Paul is writing. Paul is writing Timothy. Timothy is the pastor of a church and one of the issues that were taking place in the church and you can also read some of the other writings of Paul that brings this light. There were women in the church in their new found freedom of being Christians that were perhaps carrying their freedom to an extent that was causing confusion or disruption within the church service. So Paul is admonishing that all things be done in the church orderly and that the woman in the church if they have a question; don’t shout out right there in church, but rather wait, you can ask your husband later on.

Pastor John: Am I not right that back then the church was rightly divided with men on one side and women on the other?

Pastor Ross: Correct.

Pastor John: So a woman who had a question would be calling out, “Hey! Levi”, calling out and that would be a disruption wouldn’t it?

Pastor Ross: That’s right. And so Paul is emphasizing keeping things orderly within the church. Now he also does get into another subject here on verse 12, I would not usurp authority over a man. That is a little different. That is not talking about preaching or even standing in front and leading out doing a prayer. You know we have examples in the New Testament where it was a woman had the gift of prophecy. If you have the gift of prophecy you need to share what God has revealed to you and often that was done in a church type setting. So for a woman to speak in church and share or even to pray we don’t find any Biblical council prohibiting that, but dealing with the subject of ordination that is a different subject that is coming up.

Katho: Okay. Thank you.

Pastor John: Thank you Katho we are glad you called and we’re going to go to New York, let me get this straight, Brooklyn as a matter of fact. We’ll be talking to Jay listening on WMCA. Hi Jay welcome to “Bible Answers Live”.

Jay: Hi you guys I am a first time caller.

Pastor Ross: Hey Jay thanks for calling.

Jay: Okay my question is put as simply as possible Satan went through different manifestations in the Bible. First he was angel and then he was cast out of light. And then he was a serpent. And then he was the prince of the air. Can you explain and how long was his life as a serpent? Can you explain the process in which he had these roles?

Pastor Ross: Alright. Good question. We understand according to Isaiah Chapter 28 and Ezekiel Chapter 36 that there was a time where Satan was this covering cherub, this angel right in the very presence of God. But, he coveted God’s throne and he wanted worship and rebellion broke out in heaven—war broke out in heaven. Revelation Chapter 12 speaks of this. So Satan and his angels because he was able to deceive about one third of the angels in heaven; they joined in his rebellion and they were cast out of heaven. Then Satan came in the form of a serpent to Adam and Eve there in the Garden to deceive Eve and remember she took the fruit and she gave it to her husband. Satan was not limited to being a serpent and he could transform himself and he did at that time. Satan isn’t a serpent today. He is this angel and as the angel he has the ability to transform himself into different things.

Jay: So what you are saying he did not already possess a being that was created by God. Is that what happened?

Pastor Ross: Well he was an angel. Now angels are in a different dimension than humans for one they can travel between heaven and space. They can travel very rapidly and they can go through doors and walls and everything because they’re in a different dimension. They do have some kind of a form, however, Lucifer or Satan is able to transform himself into different shapes or different forms. He transformed himself into a serpent there in the Garden of Eden. You know in 11 Corinthians Chapter 11: 15 Paul says--or let me backup first. Verse 14: Paul says, “And no marvel for Satan is transformed into an angel of light. In other words Satan can transform himself into what seems to be a light.”

Jay: I quoted that to say he masquerades as an angel of light.

Pastor Ross: Well different translation, but same idea. He can reveal himself and impersonate, whatever and he impersonated a snake.

Pastor John: I think one way to consider this is if you or anybody has ever had anything to do with encounters with demons and so forth. You really can see these can take on different characters and formats and so forth.

Pastor Ross: Even the shape or form of a dead loved one.

Pastor John: Yeah and none of that is very pretty.

Pastor Ross: That’s right. Thanks for calling Jay.

Pastor John: Yeah for sure. We have got Dean listening in Bakersfield, California and he is listening on KAHL. Dean welcome to “Bible Answers Live”.

Dean: Yes thank you for being on the air. My drive between Bakersfield and San Francisco I really love listening to your program.

Pastor John: Well we’re glad you do and thank you for listening and calling tonight.

Dean: My question is more in regards to what some people in prayer actually instead of praying towards Christ who is the one mediator, between God and us, they are praying towards the saints or the mother Mary. And just how does that fall within the Biblical principles and guidelines?

Pastor Ross: Alright good question Dean. I can give you a very short answer. And the answer is there is not Biblical guideline or principle for praying to any so called “saints” or to mother Mary. It is just not in the Bible. Matter of fact in the Lord’s Prayer Jesus gives us and says, “Our Father which art in heaven, hallowed be thy name.” So prayer needs to direct toward God; not to any saint or anyone else.

Dean: Okay thank you very much.

Pastor Ross: Alright good call and good question Dean. Thank you.

Pastor John: Thanks Dean and that’s another very good reason why we ought not to pray to dead folks because those people are asleep.

Pastor Ross: That’s right you can’t pray to someone who is dead.

Pastor John: These are people who are sleeping in their grave and if you get an answer to that prayer I would be a little concerned. God said—or Jesus said come to me and pray to the Father through Him. Well now we go back to Brooklyn New York and it’s Millie listening on WMCA. Hi Millie and welcome to “Bible Answers Live”.

Millie: Hello yes. I am calling to find out something. Is it necessary to pray on your knees?

Pastor Ross: Okay good question. And the answer to that is no. But there is something beautiful and significant in praying on our knees. I will give you just a couple of quick examples in Scripture. Where we find people standing and praying in the Bible is for example the father of John the Baptist, Zachariah, he was ministering in the temple standing by the altar of incense when an angel appeared to him and without a doubt he prayed to God. He was somewhat afraid at first and he was standing. We find that Solomon when he dedicated the temple in Jerusalem he was standing and he raised his hands towards heaven and he prayed. But, we also find examples in the Scripture where people knelt and prayed. So I don’t believe there is just one particular form of prayer in the Bible. The Bible says you are to pray continually without ceasing in the different things that we do. So praying on your knees is beautiful though. It is a humbling in recognition of God’s power. It’s a surrendering of ourselves to Him.

Millie: I see.

Pastor John: Thank you Millie. We’re glad that you called.

Millie: When should one—I was—I wrote a pamphlet recently and I used to worship St. Anthony and St. Jude. Tell me, is that wrong?

Pastor Ross: Well you know the Bible talks of our times of ignorance and God wouldn’t want that. God knows the heart of people. We can’t sit in judgment of someone’s heart, but from a Biblical position, these people, though they live beautiful lives and you know when Jesus comes we believe they will be resurrected; they aren’t in heaven now. They are waiting for the resurrection. So to pray to them, doesn’t really mean anything because—as a matter of fact I would strongly discourage that because we know that we need to pray to God through Jesus. That’s the example that we have set. Alright well thank you for your call Millie we appreciate it.

Millie: Thank you.

Pastor John: Pastor Jean we left a few people waiting tonight and we are sorry that happens, but we are encouraged that people call and next week we encourage you to call again and right now I am going to just give you that resource number again. 1-800-835-6747 we were talking earlier on tonight about “Case Closed” and we’d love to have you have that or anything else we mentioned. That’s the number 1-800-835-6747 that’s an 800 number and we would welcome your call anytime and thanks Pastor Jean.

Pastor Ross: Yes and thank you John for joining us here we really do appreciate you sitting in. I know you will be heading out of town I believe tomorrow?

Pastor John: Yes sir.

Pastor Ross: Going up I think to Washington State.

Pastor John: Oh I wish. Back to the humidity of North Carolina.

Pastor Ross: No it is out east? Alright friends we thank you so much for joining us. Remember for more information go to the “Amazing Facts” website. Simply “www dot amazing facts dot org” and remember also friends that this is a faith based ministry and we have been appreciating your prayers and until next week. God bless.


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